Forex is hard work!

Trading Discussion
7

Emotion is the biggest problem, I find that a lot of traders struggle to trade all day long, this is totally wrong, this can then just take over your life and you still get nowhere.

Find a system at least where you only spend a couple of hours a day, arrange another income stream so that trading is not your only potential source of income, this relieves the pressure on your trading, and hey presto in a few months you are very likely to find that you have money coming in, your trading is improving so that you can use some of that income to trade with.

It’s a lot about approach, than actual systems, but remember about your expectations, 100% returns a month are not impossible, but what if it was 5%, that is a return you can seriously work with, when you’ve got spare money to invest.

8

It might be worth diversifying across several systems running simultaneously, if one or two fail, then its generally no big deal.

9

I had exactly the same experience when I was writing a pile of EA, I was so elated when I found a rather simple method of making a nice consistent profit for 10 years and then all of a sudden starts losing money hand over fist.

10

Ive never heard of a system that continually makes money. The market is everchanging and fluid, if you have a system which is totally mechanical eventually you will hit a brick wall.

11

True Talk…

12

I agree with n_aftab.

Forex is governed by global economic and political forces. Trading ranges and behavior for all currency pairs vary month to month and year to year. One backtested trading strategy might work great one year but fail the next year. This is not the way to trade. There really are no shortcuts. Read forex news, look at candle stick patterns (i dont believe any EA is able to interpret candles yet), and use indicators only as confirmations. Trade infrequently finding only the best trades, and don’t get too greedy.

Best of luck,

Ivana

13

Yes i totally agree. I have gone down the route of indicators and whatever but i have finally come full circle and the only thing I use is a candle stick chart with no indicators.

But the most powerful wepon of all, i berieve is risk reward. I think most people will struggle with making money if they only make 1:1 RR. I look for at least 2:1 or more and its a great feeling when after 4 losing trades you win only 2 trades at 3 or 4:1 and your account soars past where it was before the losses!

The problem most people have is they cant sit through retracements and bail far to soon and yes some times that is the best thing to do but hindsight is a wonderful thing. Just make sure you develop a trading plan and apply it to every trade regardless. And keep a trading diary and records of everything. Also stay away from the market if you dont need to be there. watching charts is hypnotic! I only visit the market every four hours as thats when a candle closes and i check for trades. this has done wonders for me at least.

john

14

Hi
Firstly thanks for all your views on this.
As far as support and resistance levels go, l find this can be very subjective and it all depends on how you draw these lines, and each day might be different, so l have never found them to be reliable.
If you can clarify how it can be more systematic then it would be great.

Also, l am definately looking for a system that is more mechanical otherwise emotions get involved and then its all down hill from there. So yes, all these years l have been looking for a purely mechanical system. But you seem to be saying there isn’t a system that can make money year in and year out??
I don’t care if l make 20%-30% per annum only, as long as its consistence, but this has been the hard thing to find, without massive drawdowns. I thought l found a system and did trade it live for 2 years without losing but also without making any money, which didn’t correspond to my backtesting and then l realised that on a daily candle you couldn’t actually see what price did in that day as my stop was pretty small. So now l have to go back and backtest 20 years on a 15 minute candle. Hence l am looking around for 15 minute data, even if l could get 10 years it would be great, so if anyone can help it would be great.
Like l said l have lost money investing through others, and l mean alot of money, and since then l have decided if l was ever going to invest it would be my own doing. I will never, ever invest with anyone ever again, it has just about ruined me.
Tried to look at the Aussie market yesterday, which is where l began my trading, and it all just felt so wrong.
I just get so let down when you have spent so much time and effort into backtesting all these differernt systems and you get so excited thinking you have found a great system, and then all of a sudden you have a sudden draw down and get completely upset and down about it. It has taken days for me to recover from such an upset, and then finally l pick myself up again and start from scratch. That is the hardest part, starting all over. Backtesting just takes so much time. You see for me its really hard to let go of the forex after all these years, but at the same time its fustrating the hell out of me. I just cant turn my back on it. Just the other day l was thinking maybe l am completely delusional in thinking money could be made out of the forex.
If you can make money out of property like my mother has, then surely you can make much better money from trading, surely, but then again maybe not. I am yet to meet anybody who l know for sure who has actually made a living out of trading. But l have met many people who have happily retired on property investing, including my own mother, who has done very well.

Cheers
Sue

15

There’s no magic system and making decent money is hard in anything you decide to do. And there’s always going to be an element of risk. Witness all the people sitting on big chunks of negative equity with property at the moment around the world. I’m from Ireland and there’s been a pile of property investors who’ve lost absolutely everything speculating on property.

Things change constantly in Forex. Currency movements are down to a large multitude of factors which are then interpreted (in plenty of varying ways) by a huge amount of people all over the world. There’s no mechanical system that can always and forever factor in the huge amount of variables that come into play with Forex.

I see it kind of like playing Blackjack where you’re allowed to count the cards. If you have the mental ability and dedication to do it and the single-mindedness to stick to the system and can handle that you won’t win every hand you play you can probably do ok in the end.

1 Like
16

Now I have read your complaints and have given them some thought. :slight_smile:

Yes, forex is hard work - in fact [B]Tonymand, Honorary FX Member[/B], said it very well…

“Trading forex is like wrestling crocodiles for a living”.

I can relate to that!! :smiley:

Now at the risk of blowing my own trumpet (which I am not trying to do), I would like to solve some of your search problems…

[B]This is a genuine attempt to help you, not a scam - I am well respected on this forum…[/B]

Several years ago, I made what I believe to be a discovery about forex price action.
I made use of this discovery and evolved an approach from it that [U]has a very high win/loss ratio.[/U]
This approach is not so much a strategy or method as it is a discovery - we have called it the Bollinger DNA method.
It is immune to changes in forex character over the years.

So high is the win/loss ratio that adherants will never go back to anything else.
Total newbies and experienced traders alike are pulling pips out of the market like there is no tomorrow!! :slight_smile:

The approach has a large following, and the more knowledge you have of price action, the better.
To date, 3 threads have come onto this forum about this method…

http://forums.babypips.com/newbie-island/32400-finest-trend-trading.html

http://forums.babypips.com/newbie-island/33733-multi-time-frame-trend-trading.html

http://forums.babypips.com/newbie-island/34579-xxtrizzlexxs-trading-log.html

In addition, we now have a chatroom for this method and a live whiteboard where lesson are given.
You will notice that the first thread is also one of the largest posted on this forum and definitely the largest for the time that it has been going.

If you would like to know more about the Bollinger DNA method, consult the first thread, some 100 pages before the most recent.
The thread is very thorough being divided into topics.

You can also visit our chatroom to get a first hand appraisal…

Bollinger Band DNA - FOREX Trading using the Tymen Bollinger Band Strategy

[B]I commend this method to you without encumbrances or attempts to gain or solicit finances from you.
Its all FREE!! [/B] :slight_smile:

18

This sums things up quite nicely.

19

thank you so much i will look into this bolinga band method.
Anything is worth a try at this moment, as l feel like l have tried absolutely everything.

Any other thoughts greatly appreciated.

Also, just in case anyone knows, where l can obtain 15 minute historical data? I would like it to go back at least 10 years.

Thanks
Sue:)

20

Forex is as hard or as easy as you make it. Trading is binary in nature: buy/sell, up/down, win/lose, long/short, profit/loss, etc… Too many people are pulling a con job making you believe trading is difficult. Once you understand the reason you enter the trade has no bearing on the outcome of the trade and once you enter a trade you can not make the trade a winner, you see trading for what it really is. Do not be led astray by anyone.

21

yes agreed, and too many traders are making it more complicated than i needs to be. I see people which charts where you can hardly even see price through a fog of indicators.
Go back to basics and build a solid trading plan using things that you understand and enjoy. use your intuition to guide you not a mass of squiggles.

22

i love trading. it might be hard but when you consistently end the month in the black there are few things that will give you that feeling of satisfaction. dealing with losses is the toughest. i remember last year there was a month that i started out down, a real tough week. i took off from trading for 2 weeks and a missed a great positive move. so staying disciplined when things are going against you makes trading hard. besides that, its gravy baby. i started with a very small amount and have slowly grown my account. i trust this small step approach will continue.

23

Hi, I think you are doing your head in by trying to get it too perfect for too long. There are so many variables, I think that expecting something to work for 20 years is way too hard. My humble, not very experienced, opinion is that you need to learn the fundamentals, and you need to believe in yourself and your own opinion.
I too have lost too much money investing where thieves are lurking. I invested in a listed Australian stock company that had a very good product that was turning over a billion dollars a year. If the thieves had just worked it legally we all could have made money. They gutted my husband and I when they crashed the company by stripping it. How can auditors not report the huge debts that were being run up, the bills not being paid? It is still in the courts. I have learnt, and it is time to move on and rely on myself. I see a similar sadness in your posts. It is hard and it is mean.
Now it is time to pick yourself up, be thankful you are still on the planet, and you need to learn, and you need to enjoy things in life more. When you have a loss, learn, and do not stew. Kepp pushing through, and I believe there is so much potential here in forex.
There is no actual product, it is 2 currencies balancing on supply and demand, and patterns, charting etc is very much a repeating phenomenon. You will not get it right every time, but you need to learn, learn, learn, and not expect a mechanical robot to be bale to calculate better than your own fantastic brain.
Rely on yourself, believe in yourself!

26

HI
Just reading all your posts makes me feel that maybe there is a chance to make money from forex. So now l have gone back to square one, and am reviewing all my previouse trading systems l have and l thought were no good.
Some of the systems l have very amazingly good results most of the years, but its some of the years that l am concerned with. But if it doesn’t wipe my bank then l should stick with the system anyway. I rang some managed funds yesterday and by speaking to them l realised that they do not offer any kind of capital guarantee, not that l would consider investing with them anyhow, not with what l have been through, l just don’t trust anyone anymore, except myself. But why should l invest with them when they don’t offer any kind of security, l feel more secure investing in my own forex system, even if l have a down year l know l am in control and l highly unlikely l will lose my capital with proper money management. So just now l realise that my systems are bloody good and should just go with them.
I am not very fond of indicators and usually don’t use any and l get good results without them, so am reluctant to use any.

Oh gooddykj, it sounds to me we had our money invested in the same company as these 2 guys are still going through court as well.
I wont’ say which company it was, but you sound very much like me. So we probably had our money in the same company. Still getting over this huge loss, and l suppose thats why l am so desperate to find a good system. You know there is no way l would have lost everyones money like that, had have l been trading. I would not have taken anyones money unless l knew 95% sure there money was protected. Even l can protect capital, its just making good returns which are hard. I never thought investing with this company that they would lose my capital, never in a million years. I just hope they go to jail for a long time. One of them is only getting 3 years. Its going to take me much longer to get back on my feet and has effected my entire family. Anyhow that is a different topic.
Life sucks at times LOL

Cheers
Sue:)

36

I’ve been throught it, three years of pure hell, your problem might the same that i had: price action, too many indicators but not watching the candles at all. Try trading naked and i don’t mean taking your clothes off, just watch at the candles, use support and resistance, trend channels, technical indicator simply just won’t do for you. Technicals indicators works but they are not for everyone. Maybe trading naked suits for you.

37

The best advice that anyone can give to a trader is exactly what you had stated. Price action is the king strategy, nothing beats this strategy. I also started getting success when I started using pure price action on daily time frame.

38

Trading could be very hard or easy and it totally depends on you. Treat it like with an investment or business mindset would help. Do your research, find what kind of trader are you, whether you a risk taker or risk averse, swing trader or day trader. The market constantly changing, we trader need to learn to adapt and adjust our position accordingly. I have only traded forex for close to 1 year, the profit is very rewarding, but the most important thing is that I get to discover myself more. Find what works for you and stick with it, sooner or later you will succeed! Green pips!