Can an automated trading robot survive on forex?

but i guess you have “clue”, speedy?

It’s somewhat naïve Bogdan to suggest there are few successful automated players out there simply because someone hasn’t personally come across or aren’t aware of many within the limited circles they allegedly inhabit.

In the bigger scheme of things no-one on this or any other forum knows who or how many automated players are operating successfully above or below the radar out there despite the implication of how well connected they apparently are.

As with most things bandied about in these places, it’s nothing but conjecture.

interesting point of view speedy. but i can not not notice,that you, did not answare my question.

its the tone that makes the music and your melodies reminds me of a monkey sitting on a piano eating a banana.

I dont believe in automated trading robot besides trading manually is a lot more fun.

Interesting old thread revived for whatever reason.

But from my research, isn’t 70+% of all transactions “robot” initiated. Indeed even the turtles concluded that people that were able to program and backtest their ideas had considerable advantages over manual traders.

So I don’t even understand why we have this debate. My hope is bots are here to stay, cause like it or not, the use of automated trading leaves “footprints” in price action. I can’t spot this price action, but I have a bot in development that can (hint hint Clark old friend - you up for a challenge).

Where the problem lies is, you say “bot” and the limited understanding of folks is “dim a dozen bots” for MT4 developed and sold by scummy marketers. This blinkered view limits the possibilities one can explore from their use. And considering as armchair speculators we have no rule book, why not take advantage of a tool that will give you an edge in the market.

i respect the bot trading. completely do.

i only dont believe there is actually someone, who did not invest millions in development, and is profitable with it.

forex traders like to forget what “beating the market” truly means. the average stock market makes an annuall surplus of 6-8% so if you want to beat the market you must do 8% or more. if you do 6-8% you are not “outrunning” the market.

my idea of these kinds of programs is that you let them run and you dont interact with the program or the market at all.

i know very well what it means to have something that creats money without any work.

my concerm is simply that there are no bots that can be attained by people outside of a multi million dollars company (unless a lot of money invested in the equivalemt of such s company) and ive been seeking for quite a while.

i have a friend who is doing exactly this. he is one out of a group of 7 people where everyone invested each around 100.000 in developing such a program in 2007. the programm run till 2012 and worked fine and stopped working profitable after 2012.

their conclution was a mere profit of 40% in 5 years. so that 8%a year. any index based fund or even unmanaged index basic funds (exchange traded funds)- made more surpluses from 2008 till 2012. they stopped it 2012 and invested in managed specialised funds and on average had 20% return annually.

in fact- if you took a list of the companies losted on the nasdaq or the dow in 2008 and blindly choosed one- no matter which one youd choosed (even the worst performer) you would still have done more from 2008 till 2012 than the 40% of that bot. in a bull market you only need to buy and hold. 2008 - 2012 was a bull market.

so just to see whats what im making a real offer here now:

here is my offer and i mean it serious.
show me your programmed bot that trades currencies and makes a annually surplus of 36% and i will push €200.000 in it and we share 50/50 the profits.

the reason why im so interested in this is that i dont trade currencies and never will. having a “slave” (rabot= russian word for work = robot equal worker slave / origin of concept of robots= russia) who is doing it without me putting any effort in it is a “perpetuum mobile” -or in english= a golden-eggs-laying duck. and id like to own a golden-eggs-laying duck.

anything less then 36% is just not worth it simply because a well managed fund makes more then 30% a year.

looking forward for anyones contact with proves of at least 36% annuall surplus-

People who work on EA can say best answer either robot trading is good or not. It is used by many traders how much they get benefit it is not consistent. Robot can fail any time we then can do nothing to manage trading.

You’re overlooking who this little exchange is focusing on.
As usual you’re running wide of the mark Bogdan.
It’s not the market you need to beat in order to print a winning ticket. I’d have thought by now given all your supposed experience you’d have worked that one out a long time ago.
Apparently not.

Then your idea is wrong. In fact you couldn’t be more mistaken & apparently you don’t know quite as much as you think you do, because only a fool or a very inexperienced participant would apply that tactic, especially these days.

Then quite clearly you’ve been seeking the wrong people in the wrong places.
Perhaps if you spent less time on here debating empty topics & used that time more efficiently & effectively you wouldn’t be making statements such as that.

LOL, here we go. I wondered how long it would take one of you to play that well worn, dog eared card :slight_smile:

Funny how whenever individuals or cliques run headfirst into a brick wall they begin issuing these silly juvenile challenges to hide the fact they’re either totally incapable of performing the task themselves or they try to kid others that the circles they allegedly hang around in can’t process the task either so therefore it can’t possibly work!

If you were as savvy as you lead everyone to believe you are then you’d know the right places to go in order to access the information you require.
Because that pal is what separates the achievers from the must-try-harders.

funny how you become so emotional immediately when you hear something that doesnt fit with what you believe :wink:

but never the less you still did not answare my question.

i see a lot of words from you but as usual, speedy, no content at all.

or is it that you simply dont make moneybut stick to your dream bevause waking up from it would be too costly in the form of realizing that you waisted years and money on nothing?

you have “clou”? -i honestly doubt so.

and as usual you fail to see the deeper point. i respect bot trading. everyone should do what works for him/her. i respect it enough to pour 200k in it if theres soneone who can deliver the needed “thing”.

ill sign NDAs as many as wanted and never share the program or even talk about it, if somebody can deliver it. can you speedy? if so, then lets work together and discover synergy effects :wink:

and btw. there is no clique here. Lexy hates the guts out of me, we argue on a weekly basis :wink: its only me giving a serious offer to someone who has skills in programming (what i dont have) but has no propper funding to finance his/her idea (which i have).

A considerable exaggeration! But it’s true we sometimes argue. :slight_smile:

For the record, Turbo, Speedy works in the industry and doubtless has considerably more experience than either of us. His comments to me in this thread weren’t out of line (I was, after all, pontificating outstpokenly on something I couldn’t actually begin to [I]prove[/I] at all, albeit that I felt the basic point I was trying to make was one of relevance to many aspiring traders and worth thinking about: people here shouldn’t just buy an EA and expect it “just to work”, with no education or practice or understanding of what they’re doing. With hindsight, I should have limited my comments to that point, but of course I actually overstated and greatly overgeneralised what I had to say, as Speedy quite rightly pointed out. :8: ).

You’ve missed a nought off the end haven’t you?
Coz either you’ve made a mistake or you’re having a laugh.
No half serious player will give you house room for less than mid 7 figures & you’d be hard pressed to even tempt them with that as a carrot.

The guys who ran a very popular thread on here back in the mid to late 00’s ran an experiment over 5 years ago putting up sizing equivalent access of £1.75mio each as starter funds to 6 interested, filtered candidates on a 60/40 split over 12 months.

4 of those individuals are still working closely with them & 1 other works a large far east funded account out of Singapore.

These days 100% of their forex book & 50% of their remaining books are fully automated, 40% of which is trunked through the firm dancat, soultrain & double 6 work at & 20% through the outfit I belong to.

What you’re offering was considered pocket money even 5 years ago let alone today.
You offer peanuts, you attract monkeys.

Like I said earlier, you need to expand your networking circles coz you’re quite a bit behind the curve old pal.

& that’s about the extent of most folks knowledge & awareness of automation.
The vast majority of EA’s bandied around these places are nothing more than cheap plastic toys.

As you’ve rightly alluded to, there’s a gigantic difference between a professionally constructed automated pricing program & the junk touted around retail forums.

As with most things in life you usually get exactly what you pay for.

Here we go again,

we are missing out on valuable experience, SpeedBump, because you treat people like idiots.

I am sorry but the ‘hard talk’ may work in your industry yet here on the forums it just antagonises people.

If you believe that someone is saying the wrong things don’t get all macho on them but send them a PM

and explain your insight… No point in calling people stupid… that is the trolling style of Torulf39, for example,

which leads people to actually not care what you are saying to them.

I am just personally saying that because I hate arrogance in knowledgeable people - confidence is an entirely

different matter. You do not have to call people fools… Turbo may have given a wrong figure…Big deal! He

is an experienced business person running a large operation, so…it may not be finance but he has definitely

got a head for figures. Just because he did not say all the right things do not treat him, or me, or anyone that

you do not personally know on the forum as an idiot. If you are so smart then why don’t you start a thread

and share a topic that you want to educate people in, if you have so much time to sit on forums just to mock people.

I have no respect for you.

+100 posts spanning 4.5 years hardly constitutes spending my days rummaging around forums & it may have escaped your attention but it usually takes 2 to tango in these exchanges
You often conveniently ignore the barbs & digs coming from the other side, but that’s only natural I suppose.
And there was me thinking it was all harmless banter, oh well.

Just a suggestion, but if you don’t like what or how I post then I suggest you click on my username & add me to your ignore list.
Thank you for your input :slight_smile:

ah youre so cute speedy.

now i still did not get any answare on my first question.
what exactly are you affraid of?

you claim you have you claim you know and now you claim my offer is too small?

ok then let me be generous now.

have you ever heard of meta gaming? brittish people are the best in meta gaming. so you work of a company that does exactly what im looking for? or whats your background speedy?

i put balls on the table you put talks and retreat.

now lets do it like this:

you get me a copy of the things/program your company is working on. i will put 10k for 6 months on it to test it (and the next 6 months from september till february are good trading months) and if the test is good ill open an account at UBS put €1.5 million on it and you let the program run with limited acces rights to that account and after a year we split the profits 50/50.

or if you like: get me what i want, after a sucessfull test ill give you personaly 200k in cash and forget that you ever existed or we ever had any contact in life.

you sure you know what 200k in cash looks like? im pretty sure uve never seen 200k in cash that belonged to you.

so? again only new talks or will i see a email in my business email bix which i provided a few posts ago? or will you again only give talks without any content at all?

i know quite a few companies and funds (not personal of course) which are doing what you are reffering to. but i am not interested in putting money in a fund and get 15% a year after the managers paid themselves off. i have better things to put money in and 15% is not even worth considering the effort when in the real economy you do 100-300% a year with what im doing.

what are you affraid of? scared to make money?

The problem is that we have some lack of understanding of perspectives.

A lot of people on here are newbies to trading but have successful lives as parents, career men/women,

partners/spouses, entrepreneurs, etc.; many people who enter trading are highly intelligent but find

trading difficult because it defies logic, at times, and even people with economics background may

not understand why they are losing money with all their knowledge: trading is a great leveller of

people’s backgrounds and degree of success in life, meaning that the market is an impersonal collective

that does not care for your intelligence or success and can beat you out of money and spit you out

with very little regard for niceties.

What we are all here for, unless I am mistaken, is to exchange our stories about how we deal with

our own journey through trading: there are people here (like Lexy, PipNRoll, SimonTemplar,

Emeraldorc, Peterma, Bobmaninc, etc.) who have been doing this for years and bring their own

knowledge and experience to the discussions: true, their style of trading may not suit the next

trader but you can see the value of what they have to share. Then, you have newer members,

like Manxx and Eddieb, who have put in a lot of time into sharing their understanding of the

markets, which is absolutely invaluable to us all, and we are blessed with this…

Whether you are an old timer like Clint, who is an encyclopaedia of forex/market knowledge,

or a former poker player like GP00053, or even a farmer-and-trader like Bobbillbrowne, or

even a mere music teacher like me, it is important that we try to engage with other members,

and respect that all of us have the right to a different opinion or approach to market analysis

and trading, because we are all adults with something to contribute in terms of our personal

approach to trading and to life.

I would therefore disagree with Speedbump when he says that I worship Turbo: no, I respect

him, and I really relate to him as a human being, and as a father to a newborn, and as someone

who has opinions which I may sometimes agree and sometimes disagree with but who is

intellectually equal, as is anyone who bothers to listen to other members, to their stories, and

then share his/her own story.

That is what, fundamentally, the human value of Babypips forums is.

Thank you.

Peace and love.

auto trading can definitely work, depending on the quality of the EA and strategy it deploys. Buying cheap stuff on retail venues probably won’t be very successful. I think it’s bit of a non question, it’s like saying can I make money by executing trades using a computer or do I have to call the broker old school to place the trade: doesn’t really matter, it depends on the trades that you’re placing.

I built a very simple custom EA that I wouldn’t mind giving away for demo testing. If there are any takers, should yield circa 1% return a day with minimal effort. seems to work on the tester and the last 20,000 simulations on excel gave good results but still some work to be done on it.

I think, you’re right. It is a useful tool that can help improve your trading in many ways.

I think that EAs can be profitable and helpful if (and that is a very big if) they are constantly watched by a human trader, who can compensate for the lack the robot’s ability to account for human psychology driving some of the market movements.