Does anyone really make money off of the Forex? - Page 6
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  1. #51
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    USA
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    274
    Consistency and winning long run!

    I really believe that consistency and long longggggggg run will prove the system is working or not. I'm totally agree with you that three months are too little time to prove the system. Good luck with that, anyway.

    Happy trading,
    Ken.

    P.S. FX trading is a marathon, it's not sprint!

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    England
    Posts
    290
    I am new to Forex still. I have been using a demo account and even that...I have been more inclined to not place hardly any trades. Whats the point? if your not 100% confident then your setting yourself up for a fail and perhaps even putting yourself off Forex all together. I am going over and over Hector Devilles Learn Forex Live course videos. He uses all the analysis tools I like to use. I've placed a few trades so far and about 60% lost. You might think why so much? because its never 50/50. You must take into account SL which can get hit and increase the chance off failure. So even on a potential winners you can lose.

    Even with 60% loss I still break even because of MM. so I guess for me.. I have a system in the making BUT, as many other people, i'm trying to get the Edge... to take me above the break even and into profits. I think that will natually come with screen time.

    MY goal is to get say 60% winners. With MM, taking this in reality up to 70-75%. On a £2000 starting account I dont see why I couldn't make £700 + a month "in the end" This would require 4 trades per month which get 3:1 RR. thats it! but obvcourse any losing trades will set me back but anyway this is my goal. See what happens.

    I am aware it may never happen. But with the effort I will succeed.

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    London, United Kingdom
    Posts
    170
    The only manual trading I'm doing last 4 weeks is over iPhone as I move all the automated stuff over to jForex/Dukascopy. Everytime I take profit or am about to the iPhone app locks up or crashes with messages to contact the firm or reinstall. I did $520 this morning and that's only because I spent 4 minutes calling / waiting / identifying / locating the trade. The retail forex environment can be profitable but it's a shark tank - no matter the broker!

    Microlots, zero commissions, tight and fixed spreads - think about it - how do they make money?

    I'm convinced institutional commissions with institutional 0 < slippage < ~2 and direct market access over a T1 or fibre line is the only way to go.

    The markets are hard enough to tame without all the fun and games.

  4. #54
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    Nov 2011
    Location
    London, United Kingdom
    Posts
    170
    The real conundrum is this:

    CAN WE ALL MAKE MONEY TRADING THE SAME STRATEGY?

    Once you truly understand this question then it's clear what kind of swimming pool we are all swimming in.

    Of course there are winners but the overriding truth is there MUST BE LOSERS!

    It's that simple.
    Last edited by modernmystery; 01-17-2012 at 06:03 AM.

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    England
    Posts
    290
    Quote Originally Posted by modernmystery View Post
    The only manual trading I'm doing last 4 weeks is over iPhone as I move all the automated stuff over to jForex/Dukascopy. Everytime I take profit or am about to the iPhone app locks up or crashes with messages to contact the firm or reinstall. I did $520 this morning and that's only because I spent 4 minutes calling / waiting / identifying / locating the trade. The retail forex environment can be profitable but it's a shark tank - no matter the broker!

    Microlots, zero commissions, tight and fixed spreads - think about it - how do they make money?

    I'm convinced institutional commissions with institutional 0 < slippage < ~2 and direct market access over a T1 or fibre line is the only way to go.

    The markets are hard enough to tame without all the fun and games.
    I know what you mean. Soon im going to move to the Phillippines but only if I can make Forex work. Its the whole reason im doing this. And I know the internet in the Phillippines is rubbish. cut out always. I will need to spend some proper money to set myself up a stable link there lol..

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    The world
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    124
    Quote Originally Posted by modernmystery
    The real conundrum is this:

    CAN WE ALL MAKE MONEY TRADING THE SAME STRATEGY?

    Once you truly understand this question then it's clear what kind of swimming pool we are all swimming in.

    Of course there are winners but the overriding truth is there MUST BE LOSERS!

    It's that simple.
    Yep, that's the million dollar question!

    So anecdotally we know that 95% of retail traders are losers. Now of those some chunk are those that quit in the first year. Say 90% of the 95% quit on the first year since most people who get into this game can't be stupid enough to keep going. (?? )

    What of the remainder? Now they probably split into those that bobble along making enough or breaking even so that they keep trying. And maybe 3-4% start making good money.

    So now, who are they getting it from? Surely:
    Companies that are compelled to make trade payments or hedge exposures when currencies move adversely;
    Banks that hedge their global fx risk (eg, if you earn 20% of shareholder returns in subsidiary A in uzbekhistan then you buy a forward against the expected earnings so that your EUR shareholder doesnt get mad - half the time you lose money on the hedge but that's not the point for you)

    Anyway, so structurally there are retail players doomed to fail and corporate players who know that half the time they will lose (but don't care about that). Hence if you have a strategy that is unconstrained by the drivers that the 'losers' are constrained by, then you can wait until they are compelled to lose and hence you may gain.

    Modern mystery - like the name btw - by this reckoning we can't all trade the same strategy (the losers have their own strategies and can't change). But also, some of us are destined to lose. All part of the learning process I guess!

  7. #57
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    England
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    290
    Have to also ask the question. How do they come up with 95%. On what basis? Do they take every single acount that has been opened, or only ones who have traded at least once. Or for a period of time...

    Things things make a big difference.


    It is very very easy to creat a Forex account and put real funds into it. But think of a computer game. Think of WoW.. Take a look at the amount of "sign ups" and the amount of Active players and you'll find the majority of the data used is irrelevant. They played 1 day and didnt like it, they left...

    Same with forex. The data used to get 95% has too many variables to be considered worthy.
    Do 95% of people actively try to learn Forex and trade for a lenghty peroiod of time and just fail? no. Most decided it wasn't for them after all.

    Just imagin how many people lose there 1st real trade. ALOT. There will be fear and they will stop right then.

    They are likely classed within the 95% losers catagory.

    It says it all..

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
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    1,733
    Quote Originally Posted by Epidot View Post
    Have to also ask the question. How do they come up with 95%. On what basis? Do they take every single acount that has been opened, or only ones who have traded at least once. Or for a period of time...

    Things things make a big difference.


    It is very very easy to creat a Forex account and put real funds into it. But think of a computer game. Think of WoW.. Take a look at the amount of "sign ups" and the amount of Active players and you'll find the majority of the data used is irrelevant. They played 1 day and didnt like it, they left...

    Same with forex. The data used to get 95% has too many variables to be considered worthy.
    Do 95% of people actively try to learn Forex and trade for a lenghty peroiod of time and just fail? no. Most decided it wasn't for them after all.

    Just imagin how many people lose there 1st real trade. ALOT. There will be fear and they will stop right then.

    They are likely classed within the 95% losers catagory.

    It says it all..
    Anyone who came into forex thinking there is easy money to be made and the markets will let u be a millionaire overnight will invariably end up loosing their account and all their money.

    Maybe even start a thread saying that its all a scam.

    Like everything else in life, there is much to learn.

    But there is a method in the markets madness.

    Enough said.

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    2,814
    You cant say millions over night isnt possible, cause it is.. Relativly speaking.. Concidering, a human can go to college, for 10 years to be a DOC or whatever we need to make the world run, and alot of them cant find work, or not cut out for it..

    FOREX IS SIMPLE,

    Yeah, yeah, how can I say such a thing?

    You have 2 things you can do, go long, or go short.. Thats it..

    WE, OURSELVES, Make this harder then it is..

    I do, I know that for a fact.. But when I first started, I was raking 300 pips daily, SIMPLE..

    When I started learning other things, i got caught up..

    Like riding a bike, its easy once you know how to balance yourself. You dont need to ride like Tony Hawk to get down the street, nor, do you need to take lessons to do it.

    One day traders, Onneee day, you will see what Im all about..

    O, and stop aiming for 60% win rate, thats mindless.. Do you half way tie your shoes?

    Aim for 100%, if you fall a tad short, its way better then 60%.. No?

    Im Out,

    BET

  10. #60
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    The world
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    124
    Quote Originally Posted by Epidot
    Have to also ask the question. How do they come up with 95%. On what basis? Do they take every single acount that has been opened, or only ones who have traded at least once. Or for a period of time...

    Things things make a big difference.

    It is very very easy to creat a Forex account and put real funds into it. But think of a computer game. Think of WoW.. Take a look at the amount of "sign ups" and the amount of Active players and you'll find the majority of the data used is irrelevant. They played 1 day and didnt like it, they left...

    Same with forex. The data used to get 95% has too many variables to be considered worthy.
    Do 95% of people actively try to learn Forex and trade for a lenghty peroiod of time and just fail? no. Most decided it wasn't for them after all.

    Just imagin how many people lose there 1st real trade. ALOT. There will be fear and they will stop right then.

    They are likely classed within the 95% losers catagory.

    It says it all..
    Agreed. The data are I am sure skewed by people closing losing accounts, early drop outs, etc. It must be a total count of all accounts that close at a loss or something of that nature.

    Case in point: we are about to shut an account at a loss although two strategies that were productive in that account are going to be rolled out on a new platform.

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