Is London's position as the world's largest forex market secure post-Brexit?

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Some industry insiders are convinced that it is.

Finance Magnates article:

Regardless of Article 50, London Remains at the Heart of the FX Industry

Excerpt:

After the UK leaves the EU, some financial institutions will relocate talent to other European cities, but the datacenter presence for their trading applications will remain in and around London. The latter is especially valid for FX and derivatives trading.

“As speed has become and will remain important to trading in electronic markets, institutions will be reluctant to leave the data center ecosystem in London. It has increased in size significantly over the last 10 years as a result of a network effect – everyone wants their trading servers to be where everyone else’s are,” [Curtis] Pfeiffer [Chief Business Officer at Pragma] explains.

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So…who exactly is going to be left in London?

There will likely be some some sort of an exodus of broker companies out of the UK after Brexit. Various EU regulators are certainly preparing to accept them – namely the French, Spanish and Irish ones, the German BaFIN recently went as far so as to set up a designated email for UK-regulated financial service providers which seek to move their registration or operations in Germany. The move aims to facilitate the relocation of UK-licensed financial entities in the context of Brexit.

I think it all depends on what kind of deal the UK will make with the EU once they do leave.

Yesterday the leader of the EPP, the largest grouping in EU parliament, stated:

“All euro business should be moved from London after Brexit”

Further adding that the EU must [I]“protect the interests of EU financial hubs, like Paris, Frankfurt, Dublin and Amsterdam”.

Other EU politicians including the French President have been saying something similar since the British vote.

All euro business should be moved from London after Brexit - top lawmaker | Reuters

More Banks Eye Relocation Over Post-Brexit Passporting Rights | David Sapsted | Relocate magazine

Earlier in the week, the Irish Independent reported that the Central Bank of Ireland was ready to fast-track applications from financial firms wanting to relocate staff from London. Department heads have been told to “reprioritise” staff so they can handle a recent increase in inquiries from UK-based banks.

Last year, Citi, which currently employs about 9,000 people in the UK, set up its European retail and commercial banking headquarters in Dublin and now employs about 2,500 staff there. Mr Cowle said Citi would be moving some jobs from London to Dublin. “It’s been a great experience and when we look at different aspects of our business currently in London, there will be some things we’ll move [to Ireland]. We’ll have good, steady growth in employment in Ireland.”

Almost 4.5 million square feet of commercial space is under construction or refurbishment, and a further five million square feet of accommodation with full planning permission is available in the Greater Dublin area, the report said.

My vote goes to Dublin, just a short hop for all the UK guys, and the Guinness is better.

Ireland’s International Financial Services Centre

Ireland’s International Financial Services Centre (vote here)

JP Morgan went public, the others keeping it hush, not good public relations etc.

The JPM number being quoted is around 500, a double up of staff, guess where to in Dublin… IFSC

Bloomberg had the story from Daniel Pinto

First the largest came clean, now it’s the turn of the #2.

I understand the need for publicity shyness, politics and business are never a good mix, but it is impossible to separate the two within the Brexit context, suspect our cousins are beginning to realize this.

Anyways, their planning, and that of others, was not really a secret.

Goldman Sachs boss: City ‘will stall’ over Brexit risk - BBC News

Latest state of play - according to Frankfurt:

Frankfurt lays claim to Wall Street banks after Brexit | Reuters

BOE insists that all banks have contingency plans in place, the lack of clarity on the UK side is causing many financials to plan on the basis that there will be no meeting of minds.

There are some who are making the shift quietly, but more lately many are being more public.

Increasingly it is becoming a two horse race, Dublin and/or Frankfurt.

Morgan Stanley have chosen Frankfurt, but likely they will increase their operations in many other cities.

BoA have chosen Dublin as announced by Bank of America CEO Brian Moynihan.

Btw, this from UK’s BBC: (note the green tie :))

frankfurt being popular now for foreign banks is nice but disturbing my plans for future business. maybe i should shift focus from frankfurt to london.

Nah… London is for the old days, like the ghosts of wall street, seen hanging around corners with rolled up charts, but no trading.

I’m only kidding, London will remain for some time, but times are changing for us all.

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An excellent article appeared in the June 25, 2018, issue of Bloomberg Businessweek, titled
A Tale of Two Cities. Written by Matthew Winkler – opinion columnist and editor-in-chief emeritus of Bloomberg News – this article compares London, as a financial center prior to 1986, with London after the Big Bang in that year – and then details the threat to the London financial establishment posed by Brexit.

This Businessweek article presents a point of view opposite to the one offered in the first post in this thread. As such, it will serve as a distinct bookend to this thread – provided I’m able to post it here.

Bloomberg Businessweek does not provide links to, or permit reprints of, their articles, except by special permission. I am seeking permission to reprint the entire article here in this forum, because it contains a wealth of history which should be of interest to every forex trader.

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If you know anything about financial history, you know about the Big Bang deregulation of London’s financial markets. On Oct. 27, 1986, Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher blew apart the inert blob that was the stagnant postwar U.K. economy and its ailing banking system. That explosion helped make London synonymous with international finance, ignited a cultural and economic transformation in the U.K., and even helped bring down Soviet communism.

Now, two years after Britons voted to exit the European Union, it’s worth reflecting on not just how the Big Bang was detonated but also on the principles it represented. This wasn’t an immutable act of nature so much as a reversible act of financial engineering, and Brexit has become an agent of its undoing. The financial revolution Thatcher kicked off was a powerful expression of faith in the power of globalization to improve lives—a faith that’s been shaken in the era of Brexit and Donald Trump.

I remember what banking used to look like in the U.K. In 1982, when I began my London posting with the Wall Street Journal, bankers still came to work in bowler hats and repp ties (and never, ever brown shoes). To keep the dust down at the old London Stock Exchange at Capel Court, where jobbers traded equities face-to-face on a dirt floor, waiters sprinkled the ground with watering cans.

The parochialism that prevailed back then meant workdays were short and slow. Profit was a consideration, not a priority. Friendship or nepotism, not ability, usually determined who got a job. Arcane customs ensured that the sons of venerable firms such as Cazenove, Panmure Gordon, and Rowe & Pitman would have livelihoods just like their founding fathers.

Nothing symbolized the lack of ambition better than the institution of the banker’s lunch, hosted either in the oak-paneled offices of more than a dozen merchant banks or, on more rarefied occasions, at an establishment such as Bill Bentley’s. Journalists like me chased precious scoops about domestic business over four-course meals that—beginning with oysters and Champagne, continuing with claret, and ending with port and cheese—could span several hours. Unless you knew the correct position of fork, knife, and spoon on the plate, there was no chance of being taken seriously.

With the Big Bang, the lunches were over.

One banker who never particularly liked those lunches was Hans-Joerg Rudloff, then 45 years old and deputy chairman of London-based Credit Suisse First Boston. Born in Cologne, Rudloff was a man of Europe, capable of finding investors from any given corner of the continent to put a deal together. The Swiss-German was also the undisputed king of the eurobond market, the burgeoning business of trading bonds across borders within the lightly regulated expanse of the EU.

“I still pretend the Berlin Wall was taken down by the opening of finance all over the world,” Rudloff told me last December in London, where he still lives. He now works for the Zurich-based wealth management firm he co-founded, Marcuard Heritage AG. “When borders fall, they start falling everywhere. The communist bloc was totally isolated, falling behind economically and in every other respect. The free flow of ideas, merchandise, people, capital, innovation, and whatever else flows freely led to the collapse of the communist system, which imploded.”

No financial instrument flowed as freely through Rudloff as eurodollar bonds, a type of eurobond bought and sold outside the domain of any country in the time zone most advantageous for the transaction. These had been created to recycle U.S. dollars after World War II by Sir Sigmund Warburg, a scion of the German-American family of bankers and a refugee from the Nazis.

While lunch wasn’t Rudloff’s scene, you could usually find him and his acolytes, as the clock approached midnight, celebrating yet another eurobond deal over Scotch and steak at Annabel’s, the celebrated club in Mayfair.

As the Big Bang approached, it was Rudloff who recognized an opportunity largely invisible to the rest of the London financial world when, in September 1986, the Bank of England announced its intent to borrow $3 billion to fortify Britain’s global trade. From Rudloff’s perspective, low interest rates and an unrecognized global demand for high-quality government securities afforded an even more ambitious approach than that initially proposed by the BOE. Britain had never ranged far to raise money for its foreign-currency reserves, yet not since before World War I had there been such an enormous global appetite for U.K. debt. Through stealth lobbying efforts, Rudloff eventually persuaded the English central bankers to increase the original offering by a third, to $4 billion.

Eurobonds were the perfect vehicle to harness the Big Bang, and Rudloff made use of them before the month was out to prove that London was the center of international capital markets. He wasn’t alone, though. Roy Campbell Smith, who at the time ran the London office of Goldman Sachs, remembers the Big Bang as “the restructuring of a very out-of-date, almost ancient financial marketplace that had just about everything wrong with it in terms of being able to be as competitive as it could be.” (For perspective, the U.K.’s average annual growth was 1.5 percentage points slower than that of France—yes, France—during the preceding three decades.)

Goldman was only beginning to embrace global business opportunities, and Smith, a U.S. Navy veteran and graduate of Harvard Business School, used his London vantage to enlighten his New York colleagues that lucrative deals could be had abroad. His vehicle: eurobonds. His rival: Rudloff.

“Rudloff was on the phone constantly, sweet-talking the journalists and the bond brokers into understanding the grand conceptual design of this, the euromarket’s greatest financing, its finest hour,” Smith recalled in Global Bankers, his 1989 memoir about London’s transformation. “Rudloff’s magical way with the press and the market-makers was similar to Henry Kissinger’s during his time as national security adviser and secretary of state. He was the media’s darling and its chief expert on his subject, the unquestioned authority.”

That may have raised the stakes for Oct. 27, 1986. “In one morning, we traded more British stocks than any other British brokerage firm had done in two weeks,” says Smith, 80, who’s now emeritus professor of management practice at New York University’s Leonard N. Stern School of Business. “Big Bang essentially blew away all the British rules.”

In the process, Britain changed almost beyond recognition. Thatcher was empowered to complete her privatization program, transforming British Airways, British Steel, British Telecom, and other state-owned corporations into publicly traded companies. What’s more, her political backing of the privately financed Channel Tunnel linking Britain and France helped make the U.K. a major tourism and migration destination, deepening the cultural, political, and social changes the Big Bang unleashed. Class-conscious rules and traditions were swept away by entrepreneurs in every industry from cuisine to real estate.

The Big Bang had global repercussions as well. Imitated in cities on the Continent as well as in Hong Kong and New York, it spearheaded the 24-hour market. “Both the financial market reforms and the privatization efforts spread worldwide because they were achieved in Britain,” Smith says.

The City of London was Ground Zero for these changes, especially in the early days after 1986. Walls that had separated banks, brokers, jobbers, and discount houses came down. “London was for me the best host, because we came from an environment where we had been heavily restricted—and I’m not just saying by law, but by mentality,” Rudloff says.

Deregulation and electronic trading, along with the creativity of a few Rudloffs and Smiths, opened the floodgates to huge flows of capital into the U.K.; more of it than ever before came from Asia, Europe, and North and South America. Banks anywhere that wanted to make loans, buy and sell securities, trade commodities, currencies, and their derivatives, and arrange acquisitions could now do so in London, as long as they put their money on the U.K.

Once a backwater, British finance grew into an industry that would transform the country from the slowest-growing major economy in Europe to its top performer as the 20th century ended. Soon the continent’s tallest skyscrapers began to rise from the derelict eight-and-a-half square miles that had been the London Docklands. Dozens of foreign companies erected their European headquarters in the Canary Wharf development, creating more than 95,000 jobs in what became the capital’s second financial district.

The original financial district—the City, the ancient square mile dating to Roman times—changed, too. Thanks to the Big Bang, it’s no longer “a British thing,” Smith says, but rather “a multinational thing.” About half of the 5,000 people working for Goldman Sachs in London today, he says, are not British; moreover, they’re wired into a global financial infrastructure spanning finance, accounting, law, and computer science.

This is exactly what Smith fears may be lost as the Brexit deadline of March 29, 2019, approaches. Since the referendum vote on June 23, 2016, growth in Britain has lagged behind the rest of Europe for the first time since the 1980s.

Economists surveyed by Bloomberg after the referendum have reduced their estimates of the U.K.’s gross domestic product to an average below that of the EU. That slippage comes as Europe is emerging from its economic doldrums. Last year it led the developed world in growth, productivity, and job creation after the euro gained 14.2 percent—its strongest appreciation since 2003 and the best performance among 16 major currencies.

The pound’s 13 percent depreciation against the euro since the referendum highlights the benefit of belonging to the EU and the peril of leaving it. The pound remains among the worst-performing currencies while the euro has strengthened 1.3 percent against the U.S. dollar. Meanwhile, the pound’s implied volatility relative to the euro, a measure of investor uncertainty, touched a record high in 2016.

Brexit—which won’t take full effect until after an as-yet-undetermined transition period of several years—has already taken a toll on British businesses. In the market for corporate acquisitions, British companies in 2017 sold themselves at the lowest valuations in 12 years, reducing the premium that acquirers pay for U.K. assets to 15 percent from a high of 31 percent in 2009. The comparable measure for non-U.K. Western European countries was 18 percent, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. “There’s been a real cutback in capital investment in the U.K., because people aren’t sure what will happen to the capital they invest, particularly in commercial enterprises,” Smith says.

Whereas the Big Bang blasted open a fallow national economy and linked it to the rest of the world, Brexit is inspired by rising anti-globalism and xenophobia across Europe. The same forces in the U.S. propelled President Trump to power.

“I think the U.K. has to be part of the EU to benefit from the deregulation that has taken place there and to be able to operate on a level playing field with everybody else,” Smith says. “Being isolated as they are will create a kind of little England mentality in the U.K. that is going to make the British role in the world economy even smaller than it is now. I don’t see that as being good for the British at all. The clock is ticking. March of 2019 and all of sudden they’re out. That’s falling off a cliff.”

For his part, Rudloff looks back on his long career and rues the diminishing role of the U.K. in fostering the freedom and hospitality he enjoyed as a young banker in London almost 40 years ago. “It’s going,” he says. “It’s gone.”

Winkler, a Bloomberg Opinion columnist, is the editor-in-chief emeritus of Bloomberg News.


Reprinted with permission.

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I don’t know Clint. I am by nature a supporter of the free market economy (traditional Conservativism) but I do not recognise the supposed “improvements” he credits “Thatcher” with.

The woman destroyed our ability to produce our own energy, destroyed Shipbuilding , the effect of which was to put the Midlands and the North of England, Wales and much of Scotland and Ireland into Depression, from which they have never really recovered. This and she then sold off “the famiiy jewels” for a song, as well as promulgating the inception of the “Carbon dioxide = Global Warming” lie - purely as a device to destroy our mining industry. - She later realised her error and withdrew her support - but it was too late !

I think his “Analysis” is naive at best and “Propaganda” at the underlying level.

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Interesting interview, check this

I’ll not speak ill of the dead so she did what she did. Speaking well she did manage to get many people onto the property ladder, myself included.

You are absolutely correct that her policies continue to affect to this day - I remember well that ITN news at ten used to list the number of job losses that were published for that day, always was at the end of the bulletin.

Thatcherism and Trumpism could be regarded as both being ‘conservative’, but they are poles apart - the difference in ideology and pragmatism I suppose.

Corinna reflects on how uncertainty is affecting decision making in her industry right now.

I mentioned a few businesses in another thread in the manufacturing sector who were becoming vociferous in recent weeks, this is not something that business likes to get involved with, JLR held quiet for a period though many people were aware of their frustration, there are others who will never go public but who have held back on investment - these are missed opportunities.

The UK market is huge, to invest in it means to seek a return - but there has to be some degree of political stability.

This incoming week a white paper will be published, there will be an effort to diverge manufacturing from services, the former will adhere to EU rules thus satisfying JLR et al, the latter will be the City.

Services account for around 80% of the home market, the international part of that is Financial Services - perhaps the most significant part.

The question is how will the EU view the white paper, hopefully not picking of cherries.

(For non UK - the ‘City’ is often a term used in UK meaning Financial Services transacted in London)

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[Let’s not speak of Hitler, or Vlad the Impaler then eh ? ]

You are right that she allowed a great many to acquire an interest in their own financial status by selling Councill houses. That was a two edged sword however and the ongoing refusal to allow the councils to send the money thus gleaned, to build new Council houses was short- sighted (or deliberate? ) stupidity and one of the underlying reasons why the "housingg shortage " is so severe in uk. It was a stroke of genius, tempered with the underlying bloody mindedness which the woman displayed so clearly in destroying the industries I spoke of earlier.

One also has to bear in mind that the Uk after many many years of weak “Government” and pandering to public opinion was at a stage were Our balance of trade was so dire that we had to seek assistance repeatedly from IMF who put conditions in place.

[That is the bit she seems to be promising to lock in and leave under EU control - even though it is far worse now than it was in “those days” - It is Now NOT “PC” to mention it ]

She then handed over to that “pretty boy” John Major who was toddling down the path of joining the “Euro” until James Goldsmith took a stand and the formation of the “Referendum Party” forced John Major, Tony Blair and Paddy Ashdown (Party leaders) - ALL to include comitments that Britain would not be taken into the “Euro” Without a referendum. - The Most influencial Political Party NEVER to have won a seat ! :relaxed:

“…But his determination was such he spent some $37 million to put up more than 500 candidates in the election with the sole aim of forcing a referendum on Britain’s future in the European Union, which he viewed as a German-dominated threat to Britain’s sovereignty…”

https://www.nytimes.com/1997/07/20/world/sir-james-goldsmith-financier-dies-at-64.html

Praise be for James Goldsmith ! :sunglasses: (For that aspect of his life in any case…)

You will note a certain “quietness” from those of us who favour our own sovereignty as opposed to being “Rule takers” from the beaurocrats of Brussels.

If as appears likely at the moment, The woman May is in the process of breaking her own comitments in the manifesto she produced in that disatrously judged “Election” she called to capitalise on Corbin’s apparent weakness within his own party, I forecast that despite the deep unattractiveness of any of the other Political views currently being expressed, I will never see another Conservative Govt in my lifetime !

The jury is out at the moment. We are waiting t see exactly what she really is proposing to Give away ! :rage: