Channel Trading: Viking1961 500 step system

[QUOTE=“crisscross1983;487820”]Hello Zepp,

The EA is ver 2-0 renamed as 2-4. It will not change trade sizes once balances are changed. I posted that one because you wanted the EA to use lot sizes as defined by you.
i think there might be confusions, so tomorrow I will put two different versions of the EA with some definitions so that users can choose what they want to use.[/QUOTE]

I have testet that in demo, and that part worked great, i was thinking about the part we talked about at some point, where If we are now at 0.04 in lot size, but comes back to an old erea where we have for instans some old 0.01 trades, we need to have a 0.03 Trade with same open/TP rate… So that we dont deplete our Equity by closing alot of old small trades with small profits, while opening alot of new Big trades once The TP of The small trades are hit

oohh, sorry, didnt see that one… i have sendt him a direct link to that post :slight_smile:

Hello All,

As the name of the EA suggests, this version will only place normal trades at userdefined lotsize or Autolotsize based on percentage of account balance. I suggest use this EA with user defined lot size.

Another feature is that it will autoupdate lot sizes if you increase in the future.
Eg. You start with lot size 0.01 and after one month you think you need to increase to 0.02, then all the old pending orders of lower lot size will be replaced by 0.02 and if open orders exist then the EA will place pending orders with the difference. Please try this out on demo for a week to ensure. I have just put it on demo and will test for a week.

I have included that the EA place two pending orders for every buy and sell, this to ensure that there are pending orders covering atleast 100 pips incase a sudden spike erupts which will not give the EA time to place a pending order.
Let me know if you dont like this, but i think will be a safeguard.

If there is any other query please ask.

Greenland strategy with fixed lot size No primers Rev 0.zip (2.79 KB)

okay, something is wrong… look what happend when i started it with my test settings (90 TP, dist 20), same settings i have testet the rev 2-4 with…

it opened ALOT of trades within the first min. :slight_smile:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/g4fwem17wvep7pf/greenland%20rev0.jpg

I am using the same in my demo. opens properly. Try the one attached below. Let me know if still facing problem.
Greenland strategy with fixed lot size No primers Rev 0-0.zip (2.79 KB)

still looks pretty weird, i still get more than 4 orders, and seems that they are really close to eachother…
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/93453374/rev0.png

Hi Zepp,

Use your slip as 30 if not doing so and then try.

okay, it was set to 3 from standart, what does this variable do? :slight_smile:
that seem to have fixed the problem by the way

This variable is the allowable slippage while placing or securing orders.
However this variable is also used to check if pending orders already exist.
[U]Eg.[/U]
Buy at 1.6000
Sell at 1.5996
The EA checks if pending orders exist at every open Buy order+50 pips (TP) or Sellorder-50 pips (TP). If no order exists then it opens pending orders as below.
buyStop - 1.6054
sellstop - 1.5942
After placing the two stop orders the EA must not place any more pending orders at the same values. That is where the slippage value is used to make sure that if any pending or open order exists at the values +/- slippage then it wont open any more orders.

I hope my explanation is understandable. If not just make sure that the value of Slip is atleast 3 pips (30 for 5 digit brokers) to ensure smooth function of the EA.

Regards
CC
P.S. I wont be available for the next week as i will be on travel.
Will try to keep tabs on this thread though.

thanx, that made alot of sence :slight_smile:

Any chance of someone prodding Michael or Brian to come by and answer questions about primer calculations? The info at Inside Greenland: Primers explained by @Viking1961 - eToro Blog was a lot of help, but the last part is a giant hurdle:

“the problem with some Greenlanders was that they stuck to the examples and used 30 pips distance between primers. Now with all the retracements it would never work with 30 pips. But instead of figuring out the retracement patterns they stuck to the 30 pips, which of course got hit continuously. Instead they should have re-calculated and used 80 pips distance with a little higher volume primers”

Without more info on how to do actual calculations we will never reach a useable result, no matter how conservative the approach.

Re
D

[QUOTE=“sgude0;490433”]

Any chance of someone prodding Michael or Brian to come by and answer questions about primer calculations? The info at Inside Greenland: Primers explained by @Viking1961 - eToro Blog was a lot of help, but the last part is a giant hurdle:

“the problem with some Greenlanders was that they stuck to the examples and used 30 pips distance between primers. Now with all the retracements it would never work with 30 pips. But instead of figuring out the retracement patterns they stuck to the 30 pips, which of course got hit continuously. Instead they should have re-calculated and used 80 pips distance with a little higher volume primers”

Without more info on how to do actual calculations we will never reach a useable result, no matter how conservative the approach.

Re
D[/QUOTE]

Hi,
Talked To Michael about it, and he Will swing by soon, but he has some personal health isues he has to attend to first, that, and his own Trading On Multiple accounts is taking up most of his time right now, If you have noticed it, he is also less Active On Openbook theese days…

But he has asured me last Night that he Will Be here as soon as he has his health a little better under controle :slight_smile:

CC:
just tought of an “nice to have” feature
there is a variable called OrderSwap

a “fun” feature could be to check if the swap of open trades become = or bigger than what is gained when the trades hit TP, and if that is the case, open an extra order on the same rate/TP…

what do you think?

EDIT: and by the way, the last version without primers Works great :slight_smile:

Hi guys, thank you for all your attention and also for the interest you have shown in this system. Since there was a heavy discussion about EA `s etc. I thought it was better to let Zepp handle it as he is the expert in that area. But to come to the main issue and the most discussed topic , namely the primers . Firstly it´s right that the 30 pips distance, was an example used , as it would be the right size to use for a violent drop/rise in the rate. I was very reluctant to talk about primers, in the beginning, as you need quite a lot of experience, to be able to use them effectively. Firstly you should start using primers when you have 40% of your equity left, I think everybody got that right so far. This would mean that you could, with a sudden drop/rise change your equity from going in minus, to going in plus in 150 pips. But there isn´t any method that can predict that this will happen, so you need to see the patterns of the movements. If we take last week for instance, the cable was going up and down like a yo-yo in the 1.52xx area. It was however trying to break the 1.5200 support much more times than the 1.5300 area where the major resistance was 1,5370, so a far way to go . If you would reach the 40% equity at 1.5250 for instance , you would have it cancelled many times by the retracements. But you would of course then re-open the primers at the same level. However if it then touches 1.5250 and then take a sharp drop of 150 pips, what do you do then. Well that´s where it mostly go wrong, so need to re-assess the downward movement. If your primer would have opened at 1.5250 with a 30 pip distance to the next primer ( 1.5220 ) you would have made some handsome profits as the rate retraced upwards many times. But the issue here now is, that it wouldn´t be a perfect situation as the rate dropped below 1.5190 where the 3rd primer would be, and since you always leave the last opened primer as the only open primer, your primer would now be set at, 1.5190, but the rate broke upwards above the 1.5300 level. Most would now be tempted to use more primers, when the rate again went below the 1.5300 area. But it´s contrary to the principles. This is a very good example of how the 30 pip distance would have worked against you. But it was also one of the obvious situations where we saw a lot of retracement. This doesn´t always happen so often. When the market is moving faster, but steadily it´s more safe. When you saw how the rate moved from the 1.55xx area to the 1.52xx area hardly without any retracement, the 30 pip distance would have worked great. But last week a 50 pips didtance, would have served you better, as there were that many retracements that when you put the SL of the primer at 1.5250 at 1.5246, then you would have made 4 pips profit a few times, which would have made up for the “missing” pips between the primers. But this is just 1 situation amongst a 10 fold of scenarios. So you need to learn to " read " the market. And more important, keep a cool and unemotional stance towards the market. In April we saw a 100 pip spike going down to 1.5030 and then immediate retracement all the way back and then a rise. So never wait with setting the SL in the profit area, as you could otherwise then have got stuck with 3 or 4 primers. In uncertain situations, like we are in now, with the cable ending the week around 1.5170, the 2 following scenarios are better. I have my first primer at 1.5170 I Use a 60 pip distance between the "main primers. so my next main primer will open at 1.5110, In between you use a secondary primer, at 1.5140 ,which is half the size, and then use sub-primers opening every 20 pips, with a 20 pip tp. These sub-primers are normally 50% of the secondary primers, so they are basically “normal” trading volume. Now there is a very strong support level at 1.5050-25, so you should at this level, not be trading with a main primer, but a secondary primer, in case the rate turn upwards. So you need to make this fit into the calculations. Better to get stuck with a secondary primer, which within a couple of months, will be normal trading size anyway. So as you can see there are so many variations and calculations to be made before you master the primers. I wish if I could give you the perfect solution to where and when to decide the distance between the primers, but you really need to look for patterns. Since the rate took a 400 pip drop in 2 weeks, it is likely we will see both long retracements and also long spikes… So as I said then I recommend a 60 pips distance and then apply other primers. As long as you can turn your equity, before hitting the SL you are safe. But also you need to consider that, the rate eventually will start heading the other way at some certain stage , so make sure always to have the SL´s in the profit zone apart fromyour last opened primer and at major support or resistance levels, try and avoid the last oneto bea main primer. I know that this is not the perfect answer, but for me, the primers really are quite easy to master, but I have been trading the hour-glass system , which Greenland is a variation of, for more than 4 years. Only a year ago I introduced it to others on eToro ,as I saw most traders really were left to themselves, especially the noob´s , so I was “just” going to show the system to a handful of people. I didn´t know it would have such an impact on traders , but obviously the word spread and a lot of traders which were stuck, and were still struggling to make their 3rd or 4th profile profitable , joined the club. I am of course willing to come here and discuss the issue and I apologize that it took me so long to reply, but I manage several accounts plus have my own also . And since the copy-system at eToro is full of flaws and bugs, some of the bigger accounts copying me, decided that they would prefer me to run their accounts, instead of seeing me make profits while they were losing, when copying me. So a few more accounts were added. I also have had some healt-issues, which now finally have been solved, so I should be more active again. You are always welcome to ask questions and Zepp will answer the more “technical” ones and will keep me updated with other questions, directed more towards the system. I have however followed this discussion , even though I haven´t participated in it too much, as I think there are some brilliant people here, and you are extremely constructive. I wish you all a fabulous Sunday and a successful trading week .

Thank you Michael. I am trying to limit the difficulties of primers by reducing the goal to simply maintaining a neutral position for equity (conservative size and placement). I can add fibo, but of course the problem then becomes time frame and amount of candles to count. What do you usually use for tracking retracement patterns?

Re
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You are very welcome indeed. I do get your point, but the most important is to turn the equity, while the market is volatile and then balance it out , when it become more stable. We have different sideways areas , where we can get stuck for months, so you can´t keep using primers. This is why the “main system” is called hour-glass. You simply use primers to create enough funds to trade a new level. Of course the market is moving in one direction at the moment, but it will stop at a certain point. Now some so-called experts think we will be trading in the 1.4xxx area this year, others say the rate will go up and stay in the 1.6xxx area after this dip. You need to be prepared for each option. If you just have a neutral position, it needs to be at a point where you also have enough funds to be trading also, using the same principles as the Greenland dictate in regards to increasing the volume at the various stages. There are many indicators one can choose to use, but to be quite honest,then most of them are saying the same or are contradicting each other. The same with fundamentals , they don´t work in a crisis like the one we are in. I use candles and news basically. Which time frame to use is depending on the market moves, if they are moderate , fast or slow. But on moderate or slow days I prefer the 15 min whereas when there´s a bit more movement, I use 5 min or even 1 min. So it depends. I think the 5 min is the one I use the most to find patterns. Then I trade the news, not really the published news, as they can are are being manipulated. Also most of the news are anticipated and have been traded. This is where you look for patterns. One pattern which is correct 80% of the time for instance is that, if you follow the rate between 2 ad 3 hours before the actual news are released, and it for instance in this time drop 30-40 pips, then it´s 80% sure that the rate after the news are published , will go upwards. You need to remember that there are some very big players on the market, who are able to make a better research, then the research teams or institutions , which are actually publishing the news, so they know what will happen before we do. The 20% of the times where the pattern doesn´t work, is when the big guys gets it wrong. But remember that the news corporations are owned by very rich guys, who also coincidently are big investors. So what Bloomberg , CNN , CBS etc says, I don´t really consider news. You need to read between the lines, and figure out what the guys who control the market wants. This you get mostly by reading a lot of info, and consider the credibility of this info and if it would suit the general plan. For instance to give an example then quite a few months back it was leaked that , Rotschild had invested 1 bill gbp on that the euro would go down against the usd. Now the Rotschilds are VERY private people and immensely rich. So if this would be “leaked” it is in itself unusual . So wonder why !. Now 1 bill is peanuts for those guys, just for us it seems like a lot of money. So I did believe that he/they actually traded against the euro with 1 bill. But considering all the facts and also what Nathan Rotschild did after the battle of Waterloo, then you should that they do the opposite of what they say. So I had no doubt that if he had 1 bill against the euro , then he probably had 10 bill for it. And shortly after the euro started to rise. So this is the kind of conclusions you can make for yourself, by being sceptical. A few months ago many investors were afraid that Soros would do a 1992 with the cable. Making it drop violently. But he said in an interview that he didn´t need to as the UK did it to themselves. Thats why I already in October last year predicted the rate would go down beginning of this year. Soros just “helped” dropping the AUD but he makes no secret out of it. So understand the big players and learn how to interpret them and you have much more chance of success, than any EMA; MACD etc etc etc could ever give you. Fibo proves on thing, that a rate will return to a certain point again at some stage,but not really when. But everything in life is fibonacci . The petals of flowers and other patterns also apply to these rules. Thats why when some people ask, how do you know that the rate willcomeback to this level again, since you sold. Well history and Fibonacci says it will, so it will. In the meantime while we wait, we make profits in other areas. In other parts of the hour-glass . Then some will say, that it cost too much to keep all the trades OW . Of course it cost you something, but see it like a tax or something else unpleasant. It doesn´t matter if the trade is 10 pips in red or 2000 pips in red, they cost the same in fees. Also how do you know that the rate won´t drop 2500 pips next week. So always see OW fees as a part of the whole picture. I always normally cover it with the first 1 or 2 trades on Monday. And I make around 150 to 200 trades a month, so it´s basically something you need to forget about and just accept. Also what you need to accept is that the currency crosses are not trading against you , they basically don´t give a flying toss about whether they go up or down. So the only one you are trading against is yourself. Because if you can figure the market out, the rate always will be with you !!

Thanks a lot for the advice Michael. It is indeed very relieving and motivating.
Also thanks a lot for the Hourglass system - because this is a system where no matter which direction the rate goes, we can add balance.
BTW - the EA is ready to be used for normal trades. As for primers - it is important that the news on the pair is followed and manual discretionary trades be placed unemotionally and realistically.

You are very welcome and I am happy that it was useful for you. Now I have asked and begged traders, brokers etc since months to “break” the system, but noone has even got close to doing so . Maybe you can ? :slight_smile: . Yes, i was informed about the EA and it´s very useful under normal trading conditions, and since it´s predictable when something big is going to happen, it is extremely useful . Have a great Sunday and all the best

I do not think we will ever get to a place where we can auto-trade with news or compete with human experience. I therefor see regular orders as the source of income, and primers merely as a Band-Aid to fix temporary inbalances as the rate starts trending. They should be just big enough to avoid margin call and I will be a happy camper. Making profits from primers would be a later project. Currently I’m trying to find the balance of how to calculate primer size and placement so that regular orders can move up to primers trailing SL without killing equity.

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Hi there to all. I just started to follow this thread, and I must say you guys are doing a great job. Took a look at the code of the “Greenland strategy with fixed lot size No primers Rev 0.mq4” EA and liked what I saw. The feature of issuing an order only after passing the price level is well thought out. One suggestion I have at this stage, since the primers process is not yet fully defined, would be to evolve the EA also to serve as an indicator for the trader. Providing more information of the channels state so that the trader can make faster decisions. As I mentioned in Viking’s wall, in the EA that I coded the big problem are also the primers. I am increasingly convinced that it will be very difficult to completely automate this logic and that the EA should serve only for normal trading. When primers are needed, the trader should step up. The management of SLs of primers is something that the EA also should do. The EA will never be as profitable as a human, on one hand, but also removes the emotions of the hard decisions that have to be made sometimes. I’ve been manually trading Viking’s system for 8 months now with the eurusd pair, and I know what I’m talking about…