Going offshore to escape the CFTC

[Pedro803]

Tallinex has a policy about withdrawals to credit card/bank card that limits the size of the withdrawal to the amount of the original deposit with same card (its something like that I might have messed it up a little bit in how its worded). I am wondering if this can be explained a little more.

For instance in my case I have made several deposits by bank card – so does it mean I could withdraw by bank card several times in the increments of my deposits that I have made? My first deposit was a little larger than the subsequent deposits. So I am guessing I could make one withdrawal at that amount and one subsequent withdrawal for the amount of each deposit after that. Is that how it works?

[Tallinex]

Tallinex has a policy about withdrawals to credit card/bank card that limits the size of the withdrawal to the amount of the original deposit with same card (its something like that I might have messed it up a little bit in how its worded). I am wondering if this can be explained a little more.

For instance in my case I have made several deposits by bank card – so does it mean I could withdraw by bank card several times in the increments of my deposits that I have made? My first deposit was a little larger than the subsequent deposits. So I am guessing I could make one withdrawal at that amount and one subsequent withdrawal for the amount of each deposit after that. Is that how it works?

There are two types of card transactions (deposits) … 3D-Secure, and not.

3D-Secure is not widely adopted in the US, though it’s the norm in the UK and much of Europe…

…kinda makes you wonder how the US supposedly got a man on the moon when they’re still 30 years behind the rest of the world in terms of card processing

Anyway, withdrawals to non-3D cards are restricted by the banks to no more than the original transaction amount, so there’s nothing we can do about that, but our back-office tracks all card deposits and will split a single withdrawal across multiple deposits from multiple cards where necessary.

At some point, we will be able to allow any-amount withdrawals to 3D-Secure cards, but that’s not available yet.

[tomd100]

@Clint

Well, scanning the who.is report, I see we can now add Australia and Denmark (country code +45) to the list of locales to inquire about.

Good work, Tom. Keep us informed, please.

.

So my account has now been verified at SFX Markets. I tried reaching chat but no one was accepting my inquiry at the time so I just exited the window and will try again soon. Here is a screen shot of the client back office area:

The payment systems available to me are China Union Pay, Neteller and bank wire. I am going to ask them if US clients can transact via Neteller. Further, I don’t see any credit/debit card option available. If I cannot use Neteller then unfortunately the only option would be bank wire.

The bank is located in Estonia which can be seen when you expand the menu (couldn’t fit that in the same screen shot so I didn’t bother).

When I first inquiries with them on chat, they said they did not accept US clients directly and only accept US customers who hold some offshore IBC. However, I submitted my personal ID and a bank statement - my account was verified afterward without any questions from them. It looks like Clint’s inclination as to the IBC answer being what they say publicly may be correct.

[ForExchange]

Hi Tom,

can you tell why is it bad if you have to use bank wire to deposit? I have read more times people do not like that option much although I do not know exactly what is the disadvantage of it.

Thanks,
FE

[Tallinex]

Hi Tom,

can you tell why is it bad if you have to use bank wire to deposit? I have read more times people do not like that option much although I do not know exactly what is the disadvantage of it.

Thanks,
FE

It’s really just economics… if you can fund an account with a credit/debit card (or other online payment system) then the costs will be much lower for small amounts. For example, even if your broker charges 5% for card funding then you only pay $5 in fees to deposit $100 in your account, compared to $50-$65 via wire transfer. However, once you start trying to fund larger amounts, bank wires work out much more economical.

[tomd100]

It’s really just economics… if you can fund an account with a credit/debit card (or other online payment system) then the costs will be much lower for small amounts. For example, even if your broker charges 5% for card funding then you only pay $5 in fees to deposit $100 in your account, compared to $50-$65 via wire transfer. However, once you start trying to fund larger amounts, bank wires work out much more economical.

Yes, my reason exactly :57:

[ForExchange]

It’s really just economics… if you can fund an account with a credit/debit card (or other online payment system) then the costs will be much lower for small amounts. For example, even if your broker charges 5% for card funding then you only pay $5 in fees to deposit $100 in your account, compared to $50-$65 via wire transfer. However, once you start trying to fund larger amounts, bank wires work out much more economical.

Yes, my reason exactly :57:

Thanks for both of you!

[niceday]

Your list is really complete and informational, but can you add MT5 supported broker from this link:
https://www.100forexbrokers.com/mt5brokers

[Clint]

…can you add MT5 supported broker from this link…

I don’t understand your request. Can you be more specific?

[Pedro803]

There are two types of card transactions (deposits) … 3D-Secure, and not.

3D-Secure is not widely adopted in the US, though it’s the norm in the UK and much of Europe…

…kinda makes you wonder how the US supposedly got a man on the moon when they’re still 30 years behind the rest of the world in terms of card processing

Anyway, withdrawals to non-3D cards are restricted by the banks to no more than the original transaction amount, so there’s nothing we can do about that, but our back-office tracks all card deposits and will split a single withdrawal across multiple deposits from multiple cards where necessary.

At some point, we will be able to allow any-amount withdrawals to 3D-Secure cards, but that’s not available yet.

Thanks very much for the information Tallinex, but I am still confused by the phrase “original transaction amount” – in my case I have multiple transactions where I have deposited, so am I limited to perhaps the amount of my very first deposit, or maybe to my largest deposit (in my case this happens to be the same deposit), or as it seems least likely perhaps I could have one withdrawal corresponding to each of the deposits I have made.

I don’t have a complaint, I plan to learn how to do the wire transfers so there is no problem. I am just wanting to fully understand my options in the meantime for card withdrawal, I am sure my card is probably not 3D-Secure.

Thanks again for all you help in this thread, it has been great!!

[Tallinex]

Thanks very much for the information Tallinex, but I am still confused by the phrase “original transaction amount” – in my case I have multiple transactions where I have deposited, so am I limited to perhaps the amount of my very first deposit, or maybe to my largest deposit (in my case this happens to be the same deposit), or as it seems least likely perhaps I could have one withdrawal corresponding to each of the deposits I have made.

I don’t have a complaint, I plan to learn how to do the wire transfers so there is no problem. I am just wanting to fully understand my options in the meantime for card withdrawal, I am sure my card is probably not 3D-Secure.

Thanks again for all you help in this thread, it has been great!!

As I mentioned, our back-office tracks all card deposits and will split a single withdrawal across multiple deposits from multiple cards where necessary.

Assume you made 4 deposits of $250, traded profitably, and then decided to withdraw $600.

That would be processed as $250 against the 1st deposit, $250 against the 2nd and $100 against the 3rd.

If you then banked additional gains and decided to withdraw another $600, that would be processed as $150 against the 3rd deposit, $250 against the 4th, and the remaining $200 would need to be sent as a bank wire.

As clients pay no fees for withdrawals to cards, it’s a good solution - the only real annoyance is that Visa/Mastercard rules restrict processing of withdrawals to deposits made within the last 180 days.

Anyway, hope that clarifies things.

[Pedro803]

As I mentioned, our back-office tracks all card deposits and will split a single withdrawal across multiple deposits from multiple cards where necessary.

Assume you made 4 deposits of $250, traded profitably, and then decided to withdraw $600.

That would be processed as $250 against the 1st deposit, $250 against the 2nd and $100 against the 3rd.

If you then banked additional gains and decided to withdraw another $600, that would be processed as $150 against the 3rd deposit, $250 against the 4th, and the remaining $200 would need to be sent as a bank wire.

As clients pay no fees for withdrawals to cards, it’s a good solution - the only real annoyance is that Visa/Mastercard rules restrict processing of withdrawals to deposits made within the last 180 days.

Anyway, hope that clarifies things.

yes it does clarify it – thanks for spelling it out for me. Looks like in my case I will definitely lose some deposits to the 180 day rule, I am just learning to trade :34:

But that’s OK I have been pleased with the service I have received from Tallinex.

In my case, I needed a little time with live (albeit with a very small amount) trading to really see how it is. I couldn’t effectively pretend with a demo account until I had a little more information about what it would be like live and with a small balance like I would be using in the real world.

Now that I do have some experience with Live I am able to demo much more as if it were real money I think. Also on the subject of demoing – Tallinex lets me specify the account balance I start with on demo and also lets me specify the micro account type. My first demo was with Oanda and I never did find a way to do those two things which really served to make it a lot less realistic for me than the Tallinex demo.

[4evermaat]

Will tallinex be introducing some local deposit options for other countries? Like Thailand or Malaysia. Where users can deposit via local bank transfer or even at 7-eleven in some cases and it will be credited to the account?

[Tallinex]

Will tallinex be introducing some local deposit options for other countries? Like Thailand or Malaysia. Where users can deposit via local bank transfer or even at 7-eleven in some cases and it will be credited to the account?

We’re constantly looking into other deposit options, but the problem with most of them is the inability to verify the depositor, and that causes potential AML issues.

[ForExchange]

Hi Clint,

I have a question about Forex Metal. I checked post 2157. I also watched the video which was referred in that post. You said yourself it is an eye opener. I am in the same opinion, it is quite shocking. Several forums and traders made warning signs for that broker as many traders lost their money with them. This gives me anough proof that we are dealing with a scam.

The question would be why don´t have an extra warning for this broker? First I thought there are any updates that the situation turned better with them but that is not the case, at least it was not discussed in this thread. Don´t you think a warning sign on the first page would be useful? Or another option would be to completely eliminate them.

Thanks and have a great day,
FE

[aaceofspades]

We’re constantly looking into other deposit options, but the problem with most of them is the inability to verify the depositor, and that causes potential AML issues.

Here’s my chat with Tallinex. I was attempting to use Neteller. I was told that I can’t since I’m in the USA? Anyone else experience this restriction?

---

AOS (0935) : How do I setup neteller for withdrawals?
Tallinex Support - AML (0930) : So Neteller withdrawals will work if you used it for depositing
AOS (0951) : I did not. So, neteller is not an option?
Tallinex Support - AML (0920) : yes, but with a new deposit you can
Tallinex Support - AML (0931) : where are you located?
AOS (0937) : USA
Tallinex Support - AML (0948) : oh right, then you cannot use it at all
AOS (0907) : I have a neteller account. Why can’t I use it?
Tallinex Support - AML (0937) : [B]Because Neteller has some kind of a restriction with Tallinex for US clients[/B]
AOS(0953) : ok, thanks for the information

[Tallinex]

Here’s my chat with Tallinex. I was attempting to use Neteller. I was told that I can’t since I’m in the USA? Anyone else experience this restriction?

---

AOS (0935) : How do I setup neteller for withdrawals?
Tallinex Support - AML (0930) : So Neteller withdrawals will work if you used it for depositing
AOS (0951) : I did not. So, neteller is not an option?
Tallinex Support - AML (0920) : yes, but with a new deposit you can
Tallinex Support - AML (0931) : where are you located?
AOS (0937) : USA
Tallinex Support - AML (0948) : oh right, then you cannot use it at all
AOS (0907) : I have a neteller account. Why can’t I use it?
Tallinex Support - AML (0937) : [B]Because Neteller has some kind of a restriction with Tallinex for US clients[/B]
AOS(0953) : ok, thanks for the information

Actually, Neteller has restrictions with all merchants from what we can work out - US and Canadian residents are apparently restricted to US and Canadian vendors under current Neteller rules. After all the time and trouble involved in onboarding them as a payment service provider, the news is incredibly frustrating.

[aaceofspades]

Actually, Neteller has restrictions with all merchants from what we can work out - US and Canadian residents are apparently restricted to US and Canadian vendors under current Neteller rules. After all the time and trouble involved in onboarding them as a payment service provider, the news is incredibly frustrating.

What about Skrill? Any other options for smaller amounts to avoid a bank wire? Do you happen to know why Neteller has restricted US customers? (Not that I’m surprised).

[Clint]

[B]ForexMetal (Panama)[/B]

Recently, it has been suggested by one member on this thread that we remove ForexMetal from our List.

Several considerations seem to support that suggestion:

B[/B] ForexMetal registered in the Broker Aid Station forum, here on [I]Babypips,[/I] and designated someone named Betty Snyder as their representative. Betty Snyder has never posted in the Broker Aid Station, and did not respond to my questions to her in January 2015. ForexMetal seems to have no interest in a dialog with the [I]Babypips[/I] community.

B[/B] A very negative campaign was launched against ForexMetal by a number of clients who alleged that they had been scammed by ForexMetal. They posted their allegations in most of the active forex forums on the internet, including here.

B[/B] [I]ForexPeaceArmy[/I] has recently (October 8, 2015) posted a Scam Warning regarding ForexMetal.

B[/B] There have been no positive comments regarding ForexMetal, by participants on this thread, in recent memory. And, as far as I know, none of our members currently trade with this broker.

If anyone has any additional information on ForexMetal, please post it here.

If you want to “vote” — yea or nay — on removing ForexMetal from our List, please do that, as well.

---

[B]SmartTradeFX (St. Vincent)[/B]

The other “problem broker” on our List is SmartTradeFX, which currently is tagged with a red Warning notice in our List. I have sent an email to SmartTrade, requesting an update on their financial situation.

And I have sent an email to the International Financial Services Authority (IFSA) in St. Vincent, requesting information on SmartTradeFX (which claims to be regulated by the IFSA).

There are several agencies around the world known by the initials IFSA, including the IFSA in St. Vincent; I’m assuming that this is the one that SmartTradeFX is referring to. It seems that SmartTradeFX was domiciled first in Canada, then in New Zealand, and most recently in St. Vincent — which is why I’m not sure which IFSA SmartTrade is referring to.

Also, IFSA in St. Vincent lists banks and insurance companies on their website, but not brokers. So, there is a lot of confusion to be cleared up here.

Anyway, if and when I have a reply from SmartTradeFX, or from IFSA, I will post their replies here.

[ForExchange]

Hi Clint,

my vote is to delete ForexMetal from the list. Or even to mark them somewhere so when new traders come to the thread and they search for this broker they see that it has been discussed and considered a scam.

I cannot say much about SmartTradeFX.

FE