I myself look at this as a long-term commitment. I hope to still be doing this 20 years from now.
Having said that I am only using a demo account now and have not destroyed it in the last 2 months, so I have that going for me.
I am at the point where when I am sitting back and doing “mock” trades on past charts, I’m doing pretty well.
When live demo trading starts…well…that’s a different story. I seem to do well with the 1st trade of the day, but then I start straying from my plan. I keep telling myself…“dude, you can’t do this, eventually its going to burn you” Guess what, it does.
I am now at a point where I will go…oh that looks good…then bam I’m in, then I go…wth are you doing?!
Now, I take a stance of, if you don’t follow your rules you have to sell immediately, win, loss, even…whatever. Its my way of trying to correct myself.
Obviously…this is me getting the “crowd mentality” and not stepping back and playing my plan. Until I get this worked out, I would never go “live”.
When I do go “Live” I plan on starting with small micro positions and working my way up mentally to using not only real money, but larger amounts of it.
I don’t know if I see myself doing this full-time, but I wouldn’t say no if my progress showed potential, I would like to make some extra income to demolish all debt…that would be cool : )
btw, this place is incredible for having so many people share their thoughts and methods.
Thanks to everyone !
I’m a newbie like you, (even ““newbier”” is that thing is even possible ), what I have learned throughout life is that… No PAIN no GAME… You have to put your mind to it, it’s never easy to be good at something, and you need to be good at this to get a living out of it, the question is not “is it easy?” but “will it be fun?” The first thing you should look for is that if you actually LOVE trading, if you love to do something (anything), your chances of being good at it will increase dramatically, and you won’t bother if it’s difficult or hard or how much time you spend at it, because you will LIKE what you are doing. Like Kung Fu Tze (Confucious) said once: “Find a job that you love and you shall never have to work a single day in your life…”, at a point you won’t see candlesticks anymore, but blondes, brunettes… ooopppsss. That’s another movie
Like many of you, the two year mark seems to be a nice average on how long it takes to actually understand enough of what is “going on” to make informed decisions. It also took me just over two years to make consistent gains phased over the longer term. And yes, in the beginning it can be like learning a new language, but when you can ask the right questions in your new language you can then understand the answers that you are being given.
It’s great fun, and I’ll admit that it’s highly addictive, trading is a Class A drug!!!
I’m at university, and started looking into the area of trading Forex two years prior to starting my course. I knew that at university I would have the perfect opportunity to trade early hours each and every day. Trying to do this while having a full time job would just not work. Trading hours would clash with the hours of working. Also its a great benifit being able to trade in lectures
A lot of big employers run two-year training schemes for new recruits, so perhaps some boffin somewhere has done some research and decided that it takes the average human brain two years to become proficient in a new skill…?
To pick up your final point (trading being difficult around a full time job, not the trading during lectures part (!)) - entries off the Daily (or higher) timeframe can work very well and don’t require much management or intraday analysis, if any - it is perfectly possible to enter trades at the end of the day/over the weekend through placing orders, leaving plenty of time to work for the man 9-5. Until you make your Forex millions, of course…!
I agree with ST I am not a full time trader but have been getting more profitable as time goes by. Would that mean I can quit my day job tomorrow and trade full time? NO It is my goal to compound till I get there. However There is a point that I have not seen even stated (I didnt read every post) a 9-5 job still involves risk. Anybody who thinks a 9-5 is a sure thing is either insane or been living under a rock. How many people have been laid off from there jobs witch they were at for a long time only not to be able to find another job due to the economy. They have now lost every thing just like a trader can loose everything. Nothing in life is guaranteed. If you want it badly enough then go for it. Decide the path to go from where you are and where you want to be. Thats what I am doing do I make a live off forex? No but it is possible. For those who dont make it didnt set a clear path on how they were going to get there. Me I see a way to get there slow and steady every day and you will make it. For an example If you were standing on one side of the grand canyon and you wanted to get to the other side how are you going to do it? By getting a running jump? Let me know how that turns out. Me I am going to go around it might take a little longer but I know I can make it. Now that I thought about it the quickest way to get there would have been to go to the nearest Airport and fly across. But thats my point there are so many different paths to take and no real right or wrong answer. The only real issue I see with people trying to become a full time successful trade is they try to accomplish to much, to fast, with to little and find them selves falling flat on there face and you wont hear that part because they gave up and are no longer on these forums. just like the guy who trys to jump across the grand canyon. He will never tell you his end result and I cant imagine why.
Like Kung Fu Tze (Confucious) said once: “Find a job that you love and you shall never have to work a single day in your life…”, at a point you won’t see candlesticks anymore, but blondes, brunettes… ooopppsss. That’s another movie :)[/QUOTE]
Like any job, if you do it for long enough it will bore you, but the advantages for you personally should outweigh the contrary.
If you like to be amongst people all day, or teach others, interact with co workers or customers etc., then this is probably not for
you, your dog becomes your best friend for sure. I think this is probably the reason most people fail at trading, since the human
is a social animal, it does not like to be alone for long periods of time, the percentage of hermits are very low.
intresting point of view but I guess I fall in the low number of hermits my feel my peace and quite is priceless so a good chart in front of me and everyone leaves they dont want no part of that lol
Do the work that you love and money will follow no matter what it is. This is also apply in Forex trading.
I respect the people around here in Baby pips community specially to those who made a decision to have this as their full time career once they gain experience. They made a choice that they wanted to be different than anybody else. They want to take control their own life, be their own boss, and gain financial freedom that everyone is dreaming about. What separate them to other people is they made a decision and willing to take risk and accept losses but never give up.
Funny coz I was just asking myself " What do you want to be when you grow up? Answer: Forex Trader!!!"
My first post but thought I’d add my two cents (pence were I come from!). I’m demo trading at the moment, with the odd stupid attempt at real trading! Whenever I believe I can read the candles and see what is coming next, pow, an up and down 80 pip candle forms in 15 minutes and stops me out! Back to the drawing board and back to the realisation that the sort of money we are talking about trading personally is literally NOTHING in comparison to the ‘SMART MONEY’! If this $2T market decides that market is going to go the other way, you better believe it will!
I have 18 months before I need to start earning an income from FOREX, otherwise I stick to my profession and follow the 9-5 working heard! Do I believe FOREX can work for me? YES. Will it be easy? Hell NO!
I truly believe a strategy can be taught to almost anyone! The psychology of the trader involved is 95% (imo) associated with the results long term. And that is my challenge over the next year or so.
Its interesting, we have a vast array of ppl there, some have already gone fulltime, others are trying to go fulltime. Some dont believe you can go fulltime.
it just shows that people do look at the same thing and see different things. It really is about your perceptions and not what other ppl think.
i myself am working toward fulltime, i been trading now for 1.5 yrs and am hoping to be FT in a couple more years
it is vital as well to know where you want to get to to be FT. and work towards it, its not easy but achieveable.
True, but it is also the case that we are all at different stages - there was a period when I was not sure whether one could go full time at this, then another when I was convinced but not earning, and now I am genuinely full time. It is like anything in life - look back on stuff later and one often forms a different view!
At the risk of mentioning the obvious, one of the great possible advantages of trading is that you don’t have to be ‘full time’ at anything.
I wouldn’t mind an existence where I’d love trading as a sort of intellectual study and hobby, but the actual moneymaking trades would be based upon a few minutes of analysis per day… or less. I’d love a mini MT4 on my phone, something better than a broker app, that would fit the bill nicely. Perhaps that’s an extreme dream. But maybe not!
One of my small businesses ~ small volume, not huge money by any means, but on one of the days when I ship product, I spend perhaps half an hour putting circuitboards in a box to be shipped. For a 1000 dollar order, that makes about 2000 USD/hour (of course, I’m not shipping products all day). Manufacturing is… emailing asia, sending a wire transfer, that’s it… pretty much all that’s left for me to do is put product in boxes and collect money, and do corporate taxes &c once a year. That first small business changed my life ~ gone were the 12 hour stressful days, and enough time to sit and think about small business #2 thoughtfully over a coffee by the seaside. Same with business #3. And so on. Forex will be small business #4 for me, and possibly the most long lived one (I doubt forex will go obsolete).
Perhaps it’s overconfidence, but I have no doubt that I’ll eventually master this to make as much money as I’d care to at it. As money is a necessity, not an end in itself. And once it’s going strong I’ll definitely be here to try to help others.
When I started FX trading my main goal was to turn it to my main business. I started trading after finishing a basic course and it took me about a year to be green. I improved my techniques and money management skill and now I take money from the markets every month. However, over the years I realized that it takes too much energy and I reduced the intensity of the trading. I take an average salary from the markets as an passive income and I am satisfied with that. My point is that I do not think that anyone should set a goal of being a full time trader, because it cannot last forever. Just try to make a dissent income from trading and move on to other businesses.
JoJo, I’m not exactly sure what you mean by “it cannot last forever”. I personally trade full time, and make a good income by almost anyones standards. Haven’t been doing it forever of course…only full time about 2 years, but In terms of trades taken, I have a significant edge that I can execute anywhere from a few times to up to approx. 40 times a day when the markets are really showing me my setup criteria a lot, and I’m in a good mindset to take advantage of those setups.
That being said, I don’t make big pip numbers per trade. I think I average about 20 pips profit per trade… but I can (and do) easily scale up by trading more contracts (i trade forex futures primarily, not spot much)
I don’t exactly know what you mean by “too much energy”… I think it would depend on ones’ approach. This past week, the vast majority of my trading was conducted during the first 3 hours of the euro session, for 5 days in a row.
So, I put in about 15 hours this week, trading one full sized contract per trade (or 2 mini contracts…same value as a single full sized), and pulled enough this week to put me on track for a 4 week, 5 figure income.
as my bankroll grows, and I am comfortable, I can easily throw on 2nd contract, and double that. In the markets I trade, I could probably easily take up to a 4 - 10 contract position in each market at any given time, and experience almost no additional slippage… maybe a pip, 2 pips at most per trade.
If I had traded a 10 contract position this week on my trades, taking the same entries and exits, I could have pulled in over $20,000 this last week, for 15 hours of work. Do this every week, and you have a million+ per year income
I don’t know too many businesses that allow one to make a 7 figure income per year, while putting in only 15 hours of work per week (20 hours total, including prep time). Furthermore, no hassle with employees, no problems with paperwork or admin stuff, no hiring, firing, recruiting, training, managing, marketing, biz developing, or customer servicing. No loans, no property mangement, no payroll taxes, no time away from home and my family, no meetings, no commuting, no conferences, and none of the other b.s. associated with running a typical business (having run 3 before, I know this first hand)
Just analyze, point, and click.
That’s kinda the whole point of trading… to have a very easily scaleable business that it is possible (albeit rare) to develop a 7 figure income or net worth from the comfort of ones own home while only working a few hours per week without any management headaches.
Don’t get me wrong now…I worked for years as I failed, lost over 10K while doing so, called multi-month breaks while I devoted myself to my other business endevors, and in spite of starting around 2004-5…really wasn’t profitable consistantly until 2009.
But that being said, it was worth every minute and dollar, and I would do it all over again now if I had to.
So, if you mean it takes too much energy input from you for the reward you see…that may be true.
However, don’t mistake your input and output and what is worth it or not with someone elses. Not trying to come off confrontational here, just want to make it clear what an alternative possibility is when it comes to trading.
And btw…if you are already making a passive income, why not just put more up per trade. (if your risking 1%…does your winrate justify risking 1.5% or 2% without putting you in danger of an unacceptable drawdown?) Increasing 1% risk to 2% risk per trade, if it is mathmatically “acceptable”, could mean the difference between making a decent passive income, and literally generating a mid 6 or even 7 figure income.
20K, at 3% per week, ends up generating over 7 figure net worth in 3-4 years time. That’s quite powerful.
If you cannot do this, I would speculate that its your particular edge that is limiting…not forex, or the markets in general.
I do it since almost 2 years now 1.5x full time (12 hours a day). Well, my other business is now a part time job on top of that, lol. I closed one account in 30% profit already after 1.5 years. Not much money, because it was just around 300 bucks and I have to subtract the expenses for vps etc., but better than a loss. Learning and getting paid a little is the best what could happen.
At first I was not so comfortable with the idea to stare at charts all day. That’s why I coded my bots and let em trade. Right now I even find harmony in looking at charts every day. At first I thought it would bore me after a while, but there is soooooo much to learn every day and I love to learn. New tools, books, indicators, etc. Actually I find it quite interesting to think I could do this for the rest of my life. Just a trade here and there if the probability is high in addition to the bot trades.
My opinion is if you love what you do you will sooner of later get success. The issue with those quick rich guys who try to make a killing with fx in 1 months is that they seem not to really love their trading job. If they would love it, they would find it more appealing to do it for a longer time than just thinking it works in a year or two and they can retire after that with gazillions. That’s why they imho don’t have success and blow accounts one after another.
This whole thing (trading) is imho not about making money only, but to understand how markets work and to find it appealing to trade year after year and build a career on that. If both parts are there then it is imho just natural that success will be the compensation for your own effort.
A part time trader beside his full time job can have also success, but imho not the same success. He can make money with it, but as with every part time job you can not do it with that passion, because you have another job which takes most of the time and energy away and you can not learn that fast.
Well, ok, in light of bucks post, and in the spirit of full disclosure… I probably watch the markets off and on for about 14 - 16 hours a day. I probably actively watch for 6 - 8 a day. These days, I am cutting my trading down to my most proftiable setups and profitable hours…and thats about 2 - 4 hours per day.
Truth be told, I, like bucks, absolutely love what I do. I’ve always wanted it, since before i really even knew what the market was. I can watch it all day, every day.
And all this watching and love of charting and markets and such tends to give way to picking up observations and discovering very subtle clues as to the next move(s) of a market.
If all one does is sit and stare at the sky… predicting with a high degree of accuracy which constellations will appear next month, or which type of bird will likely pass overhead next week, becomes quite obvious.
my TRADING last week took less than 20 hours… but my market observations, learning, interpreting…etc…? lets just say that if i wasn’t sleeping, i was watching. if i wasn’t watching, i was thinking, if i wasn’t thinking…i was discussing, if i wasn’t discussing, i was watching more…charts… get it?
But you’ll tend to find this with anyone in any industry that performs well above the average. They gain mastery not because they choose to gain mastery…it’s because, in many ways, mastery chose them. They cannot imagine doing anything else. They love the good, they love the bad, they love the ugly. They do not so much as have a career, but indeed, their career has them, completely!
A deep, burning passion for both excellence and experience combine to create a mind blowing work ethic, and from that, a level of insight and mastery that most cannot fathom.
This is not for everyone. This is not even (i believe) capable to be grasped by many, nor should it. This type of success comes at a price. The most successful in any field are usually not balanced individuals. They are driven. They are focused…they may even border on psychologically atypical, since their lives tend to be very lopsided in their priorities.
Many will read this post, and think “gee, i got into trading because i wanted some easy money… i don’t want obsessive fixation! I want more free time…not less! and watching price bounce green to red is anything but what i want to spend my time on. I just want to make a few trades a week, acheive above average gains of 20%+ per year, and be done with it.”
GOOD! this is what most will say. and this is what most will settle for…if not much less than that. That’s a normal, typical, decent response to the insane level of comittment it takes to really pump out the crazy big ROI’s.
But…my point is, sounds like for bucks, and I know for myself, those who really do substantially above average don’t do it because they choose to master the markets… they do it out of a deep fascination and, for lack of better word, love, for the markets.
On a personal note…when people ask me what i do for fun, i have a hard time answering that. I work. this is my fun. my work and my leisure time are one in the same. It’s not work for me… it’s an ongoing challenge to crack the worlds richest puzzle…and it’s dynamic in such a way it’s new solution each day… like a game.
Choosing to become highly successful in any particular career, IMO, is not as much a function of choice, as it is a function of passion. Pure, unbridaled passion. Once someone finds out what they are deeply passionate about…it’s uusally only a matter of time before they become amazingly adept and successful within their field.
I find this post getting a little off topic here with my rant, and just to clarify my position:
Anyone with some aptitute and interest can dedicated themselves to finding a way to trade the markets to acheive
above average success per year, say 15% - 25% per year. This can be done without an inordinate amount of time…
just some good information, good execution, and good risk management
But how to explain those who bring in 15% - 25% per MONTH, or more? they don’t acheive this through choice. they acheive it through passion. Plus, a whole littany of other components…but each of those others was the result of focused, dedicated, intense passion.
), what I have learned throughout life is that… No PAIN no GAME… You have to put your mind to it, it’s never easy to be good at something, and you need to be good at this to get a living out of it, the question is not “is it easy?” but “will it be fun?” The first thing you should look for is that if you actually LOVE trading, if you love to do something (anything), your chances of being good at it will increase dramatically, and you won’t bother if it’s difficult or hard or how much time you spend at it, because you will LIKE what you are doing. Like Kung Fu Tze (Confucious) said once: “Find a job that you love and you shall never have to work a single day in your life…”, at a point you won’t see candlesticks anymore, but blondes, brunettes… ooopppsss. That’s another movie