Tony, as always, you have a very good point.
Tell you what: how about I check with ‘the man himself’ on this!!!
Get back to you all!!!
What do you think about Interbank FX Their TA tools have Expert Advisor built around the MLQ language (metatrader?). this leads to Automated Trading. They also have a candlestick identifier and patter spotting tools. I’m opening a practice acount soon. I’m demoing FXCM right now. What do you guys think about this FX site?
With regards to PSAR + ADX DMI, I tried using that style but I find the ADX DMI indicators lagging. For example, PSAR triggers a buy while DMI is in short mode (with usually declining ADX ). After some time the DMI now goes into positive mode and ADX picks up but no more chance of going back in through PSAR signals.
OK: I have sent a message to Mr Wilder’s organisation to get their ‘take’ on what we (I) want to do. As soon as I get an answer I’ll post their ‘take’ on the subject.
I’ve looked at most ‘demos’ in that past couple of months and I can’t say I like Interbank FX’s platform OR ANY platform tha uses Java. But that’s just me. Having said that they get good reviews (generally) so it’s up to you.
As far as ADX is concerned: you do have a point BUT I think that is where ‘patience and self control’ come into the picture i.e. yes there will be trades that you miss, some of them probably very good ones, but you need to look at the trades that do in fact turn out to be profitable when Parabolic SAR, ADX, and RSI are ‘in alignment’. They are normally the ‘home run trades’!!!
(And yes: I’m ‘pushing’ my post count)!!!
It’s taking every thing I have not to post two more ‘bullsh*t’ messages here to hit 1000!!!
OK, somebody, PLEASE ask me a question that I can answer!!!
[B][I]For Perry:[/I][/B]
[B][I]Sorry it is not the last post of mine on this page that you should be reading i.e. not this message (I’ve posted some messages since sending you my email. It’s the message above that starts with ‘995 and counting (you still did not tell me if you won a prize)!!!’ that you need to be looking at.[/I][/B]
Are you excited about reaching a 1000!
Whew, thanks Tony, I was getting worried there for a minute i.e. I could just picture everyone saying to themselves ‘not a f*ck am I going to ask him a question’!!!
Check it out!!!
Congratulations Dale and welcome to the club!
you too tony.
tony i guess you been one of the men for a while.
thankyou both for all the advice and helpful writing you do here.
Im still demoing trying to figure out what works good.
i thought i would have been trading live by now, but not ready yet.
reading a lot of forums, books and lots of practice.
It seems like just about every pair is ranging right now and im not in any trades right now.
i know i have to wait for the trade to come to me and not make the trade look like i want it too, if you know what i mean.
I did good up until the fed cut rates and all my trades had profit locked in and was stopped out.
I still really like PSAR , just need to find the right filters, knowledge to get in the trade at the right time.
keep up the good work and $ 10 for wilder’s book wow!
Thankyou tony for getting that discount for everyone
Whooooa!!!
NO. Wilder’s book will cost $45 from The Delta Society not $10 (somebody managed to find it in a used book store for $10). Amazon’s price is $65 (The Delta Society is discounting it by $20 for babypips.com members).
Just needed to clear that up.
Doesnt really matter how long it takes you to get there as long as you do and dont take any avoidable risks while learning. Its Dale to thank for the discounts
OK, well, now that I’m an ‘FX-man’, I have to start thinking and asking questions worthy of the title!!!
And here is the first one:
This is something that has been ‘bugging’ me for a while now.
It relates to the brokers that are in different timezones.
OK (and this is for the ‘tonymand’s’ and the ‘rhodytrader’s’ - you’re input is needed here):
If you’re trading CFD’s on the NYSE you have no problem i.e. the NYSE opens at 9:30am New York time and closes at 4:00pm New York time and it is only during those times that you can trade regardless of where your broker is situated. Right? Right!
But now:
Forex (as we all know) is traded 24 hours a day. Right? Right!
The problem (if there is one) is this:
Delta Stock is in Bulgaria SO at 1:00am in the morning I get a new daily bar for all THEIR forex pairs (OK, the bar appears at 1:00am Bulgarian time but it’s delayed by an hour for some or the other reason i.e. it should appear at 12:00am in the morning Bulgarian time but it’s of no consequence for the purposes of this question). GCI Trading is in Belize and their time is exactly the same as New York time so at 12:00am in the morning New York time I get a new daily bar for all THIER forex pairs. Bulgaria (and South Africa at the moment, due to daylight savings in Bulgaria, are in the same timezone) is six hours ahead of New York time.
NOW:
The question is this:
Does it make a difference to your trading of forex pairs?
While the ‘obvious’ answer MAY be ‘no’ it’s not quite that simple and I’ll tell you WHY I say this (and WHY I’m wanting some more input on this).
All of the systems (in ‘New Concepts In Technical Trading Systems’) are HEAVILY weighted in favour of the close of an instrument or pair. Because of the time difference between my two brokers as noted above the (my) closing price of an instrument or pair on my Delta platform will be different from the closing price of the same instrument or pair on my GCI platform. In other words: taking GBP/JPY as an example, the closing price (daily as always) on my Delta platform on Monday, 14 January 2008, was 211.59 (Middle), and the closing price on my GCI platform on Monday, 14 January 2008, was 212.60 (could not log in to my GCI platform as it is Saturday and they do maintenance over the weekend so I’m just using the price of 212.60 as an example so don’t bother to check because it’s not the REAL closing price but suffice to say there will be a difference).
OK so far?
OK, so we’ve established that is is going to be a different closing price between the two platforms every day.
Again, this may not SEEM to be a problem, because, for example, at Delta you are still getting a bar for the preceding 24 hours, and, of course, the same applies at GCI. Right? Right!
BUT, and I think it’s a ‘BIG’ BUT:
From what I gather, regardless of what trading system you are using, the closing price is ‘all important’ and you have to ask yourself the question ‘who or what makes the forex markets move?’. Now if the answer to that question is the big institutional traders (banks?) and if they are basing their next move on the closing price in New York then the next movement is going to be ‘weighted’ in favour of or ‘based on’ the New York closing price and NOT the closing price in Bulgaria!!! See what I’m trying to say? In other words: any trading decision made or ‘based’ on the closing price of an instrument or pair in Bulgaria is going to be made or ‘based’ by ONLY those trading at Delta Stock (or any other broker in the same timezone) BUT (and this is the ‘crux’ of my question) any trading decision made or based on the closing price of an instrument or pair by the rest of the world would be made or ‘based’ on the closing price in New York SURELY???
What do you think of my ‘assumptions’ AND does it indeed make a difference?
I’m thinking like this: if an instrument or pair has apparent momentum, for example, in a certain direction on my Delta platform (Bulgaria) at 12:00am Bulgarian time the instrument or pair MAY OR MAY NOT have the same apparent momentum, for example, in the same direction by the time it is 12:00am New York time AND this (I think) could drastically affect the results on ANY trading system that favours the closing price of an instrument or pair.
Whew, that was ‘quite a mission’ to explain, but I hope what I’m asking makes sense?
Edit:
Actually, at the risk of answering my own question, the more I think about this the ‘bigger a deal’ it becomes!!!
Put it another way:
EVEN IF you are ‘trading naked’ (I think is the term used for when all systems and indicators have been tossed aside and you’re trading based purely on price and candlestick patterns) you have a potential problem because of the above.
Let say that (using ‘Chucky’s’ system as an example) at 12:00am Bulgarian time I get a signal to go long based from the system bsed on my Delta daily chart. The price goes up a little but in the next six hours the price starts falling so that by 12:00am New York time I am now getting a signal to go short on my GCI daily chart based on exactly the same system. I now have two totally opposing signals AND, what’s more, let’s assume that the ‘collective’ is now going to go short based on what they are seeing at 12:00am New York time: what do you think is going to happen to the price??? It’s obvioulsy going to fall because there are more traders behind the down move than there are behind the up move!!! While it is one thing ‘not going with the crowd’ I’d rather be on the institutional traders side of the trade thank you very much (Societe General being the obvious exception to this rule at the moment)!!!
The IRONY about all of the above is the fact that it WOULD NOT affect an indicator like Parabolic SAR!!! How about that??? The reason being is that Parabolic SAR will give you a ‘dot’ every 24 hours based on the chart you are watching regardless of where you are watching it.
Another thing: when you’re looking at Bloomberg or CNBC or CNN Money, when they show on their tickers that a pair is up at the moment or down at the moment, that change is the difference between the close at 12:00am New York time and the current New York time if memory serves me correctly. How many traders do you think may be watching these figures and (possibly foolishly) be basing their next move on these figures? I don’t think it matters that the GBP/JPY MAY be up since 12:00am Slovenian time do you???
And I don’t think it’s just 'lil ‘ol me’ that’s got a ‘personal’ problem because I happen to trade at a broker in Bulgaria. Brokers throughout the EU and Russia are ‘a dime a dozen’. Just how many retail traders do you think are trading with these brokers ALL going ‘against the New York crowd’???
Of course, I hasten to add, this obvioulsy only affects the daily (and longer) timframes BUT having said that, which is more important to the institutional traders (banks?)?: the closing price half an hour ago or the closing price yesterday???
No offense to anyone BUT I am going to repeat my ‘view’ on trading forex pairs versus the trading of CFD’s: TRADING CFD’S, INDICES, METALS, AND COMMODITIES, IS WHAT CAVIAR IS TO FINE DINING; FOREX PAIR TRADING IS THE CULINARY EQUIVALENT PRETZELS!!! (Kind of like the difference between Gordon Ramsay and Jamie Oliver)!!!
I’m telling you something now that IF I CAN manage to build my account up to where I can start trading the ‘proper’ Dow, Nasdaq, and S&P (AGAIN) I ain’t ‘touching’ another forex pair!!!
The answer is short and sweat.
It doesn’t matter.
As long as you use the same closing time consistently, then all else is totally meaningless.
Congratulations also to dpaterso for making the team! Thanks for all your hard work and helpful contributions to the BabyPips.com Forum! Keep up the good work!
-Forex Forum Admin
Thanks for the answer John, although I’m still not convinced, sorry.
I suppose the answer to the question really relates to market sentiment and who the driving force in the market is.
I suppose another way of explaining what my ‘issue’ is by way of a question: ‘Which global closing price is being monitored by the powers that be’?
Another (‘extreme’) way of demonstrating my point would be this:
What if it was possible for 'lil ‘ol me’ to ‘instruct’ ALL the major banks in the world to sell GBP/JPY at 2:00pm (their) local time. What would happen? Nothing major would happen I’d wager. Now, if 'lil ‘ol me’ could ‘instruct’ ALL the major banks in the world to sell GBP/JPY at 2:00pm New York time? What do you think would happen then (and don’t anyone go telling me that this would not be possible because then there would be no buyers i.e. I do understand that and that is why I said this was an ‘extreme’ way of demonstrating my point)?
Again, I come up with this:
I get a candlestick pattern to go long the GPY/JPY at 12:00am Bulgarian time at the broker in Bulgaria and I go long. During the next four hours, instead of the price going up, it goes down. When I open my New York brokers chart at 12:00am New York time I now have a totally different candestick pattern telling me to go short. Only one of them can be right. If there is enough ‘steam’ coming from Bulgaria then the price will go up again. If not and the ‘steam’ is coming from New York it’s going to go down.
OK, in fairness, this would only affect day traders not intraday traders, and would only be of consequence on the daily and four hour charts i.e. all other timeframes would be fine.
This would also be of no consequence if there is a rally or trend in progress but I’m of the opinion that this certainly is of great consequence in a ranging market.
By the way: who is trading in the ‘pre-market’ i.e. the hour BEFORE the NYSE opens??? I know I can’t trade anything until 9:00am New York time so what is this ‘pre-market’ trading that I monitor every morning??? Who is allowed to trade outside of the NYSE’s trading hours??? Is it just pending orders that are being referred to or what???
I need to shut my workstation down and ‘walk away’ for a couple of hours. This type of thing could (and probably will in the end) drive me nuts!!!
On the other hand: is this not the greatest ‘business’ in the world??? I know of no other ‘business’ that will ‘clear those cobwebs in the mind’ away like this ‘business’!!!
If traders (institutional and individual alike) only operated on a daily closing basis, then maybe there would be something worth talking about here. But they don’t. They operate in all timeframes and execute trades all throughout the day.
As I noted before, in the application of technical analysis in a market which really only closes for the weekend, it doesn’t really matter when you define your close, so long as you use the same one all the time. It’s not as if the prices are different.
Hi ChuckNorris
You defined a higher high as:
Higher high is when price closes higher than previous day/week (depending on which time frame you use).
So I can deduct that a lower low is:
Lower low is when the candle closes lower than previous day/week (depending on which time frame you use).
But in this chart that you posted, the lower low candlestick closed at a price higher than the previous red candlestick.
Could you tell me what I am getting wrong.
PS: this is my last post in this thread.
adamzgreat:
When I first saw your post I thought to myself: ‘What is wrong with this person?’ BUT I myself have just had another look at ‘Chucky’s’ system and I can see WHY there is confusion i.e. I’m confused myself so I apologise for thinking you’re a ‘twit’!!!
ChuckNorris says:
Higher high is when the price closes higher than previous day/week
ChuckNorris, I hate to tell you but it is INDEED confusing i.e. a ‘higher high’ is exactly what it says and a ‘higher close’ is ALSO exactly what it says so by ‘wording’ it the way you have nobody seems sure as to what you’re actually trying to say (no offense).
The question is:
Are you talking about ‘higher closes’ or ‘higher highs’? In other words (depending on your answer) should the above statement ACTUALLY read as follows:
[I]Higher close is when the price closes higher than previous day/weeks close[/I]
OR should it read:
[I]Higher high is when the high price reached is higher than the high price reached the previous day/week[/I]
OR should it read:
[I]Higher high is when the price closes higher than the high price reached the previous day/week[/I]
Sorry but there is a big difference between these statements and I can see why adamzgreat is getting confused.
lol. Please read my system again. I never mentioned anything about lower close or higher close.
Hey ‘Chucky’, I know how you feel BUT I’m afraid I HAVE to try and help out here again.
I printed out the page where you detailed your system on this thread and I’m looking at it now.
At the top of the page (paragraph three) you state the following:
If you wanna sell then find a candlestick that makes a Higher High. Higher high is when price closes higher than previous day/week (depending on which time frame you use).
Right? Right!
I think the problem is this: a candlestick can have a higher high but that does not necessarily mean it closed higher. See what I’m getting at? It’s the paragraph quoted above that is causing the confusion (I assume).
In other words I’m saying this:
[I]Sell:[/I]
[I]1. First candlestick makes Higher High (does not matter where it closed)[/I]
[I]2. Second candlestick makes Lower High (does not matter where it closed)[/I]
[I]3. Third candlestick breaks low (not close) of 2nd candlestick (candlestick that made Lower High)[/I]
[I]4. Sell when 3rd candlestick breaks low (not close) of 2nd candlestick.[/I]
etc. etc. etc.
Am I AT LEAST getting the picture??? If so then that should solve everybodys (including your) problem (your problem being the fact that you’re going to have to keep repeating yourself until you clear this up. Trust me on this one. How do you think I got to 1000 posts? They were not all ‘original’ ‘pearls of wisdom’ I can assure you).