Ultimate Forex Secrets indeed - hahaha. I remember not so long back thinking there was some 1 secret that would give me millions…sad to think there are people every day getting this treatment and setting themselves on a road to disapointmnet.
How have you got on with Covel’s Book ?
tbh I struggled with it
Only just started it so will yet to see how it will pan out. I only just noticed he’s got a film out as well “Broke - the new American dream”. I just finished Pring on Price patterns so I’m hoping Trend Following won’t be too much of a leap.
I think the biggest benefit from taking and completing a good course, in any area, is that it gives you confidence, which is crucial in every profession! Not everybody needs that. There are very capable self-taught individuals who can accomplish great things on their own or with very little support.
However, there are others who may be on the right track but they are hesitant to solely trust themselves and go on, especially at the beginning when they lack experience. A good course, from an experienced trader, although it may reiterate the same principles, strategies, etc gives the student the extra boost to make a decision to open or close, or increase his position because he learned how to do it from a bigger and better one! Simply it adds weight to what he already knows or to what he can learn for free! How much one is willing to pay for that is a personal matter!
I’m an average skilled trader and I think BabyPips.com and the web offer plenty of good info a beginner can use to become a profitable trader but I would take a good FX course if I consider that I need improvement in certain area or learn new things!
BTW, I’m new here but I love the site and the forums! You guys rock!
thanks for your review. have a look at this review now
Greg Secker is not American. He is South African. Seckers training could be very suitable for some, for me it didn’t do it because it seems mainly aimed at beginners. I wouldn’t pay too much attention to all those who keep trashing every single trading course out there. There seems quite a lot of people posting negative anonymous reviews! You need to feel what is right for you, and whether the training center you are interested seem to be able to make you understand trading better. In the end, its your own efforts that will make you succeed or fail. Trading is not for everyone.
I agree, babypipser. Being self taught can end up being a very expensive experience. So I don’t fully agree with all the comments to “just google” and learn from there. Truth is, as a beginner, someone doesn’t know what information out of the tons available on the web, is valuable or not. A training course is really the best start, in my opinion. And I was initially self-taught which helped, but I still took training.
Hi
Simon Templar took this course. He seems to be OK with it.
Regards
Kevin
I just had a run in with Knowledge to Action and my Advice would be stay well away. One thing they dont tell you is that if you try and cancel after giving them the £500 deposit (which I was foolish enough to do) they will charge you for the rest of the whole course, regardless of whether you attend or not.
To quote their terms and conditions:
“2 weeks or less before the course start date – 100% of the agreed Tuition Fees is due;
3-4 weeks before the course start date – 75% of the agreed Tuition Fees is due;
5-6 weeks before the course start date – 50% of the agreed Tuition Fees is due;
7+ weeks before the course start date – 25% of the agreed Tuition Fees is due.”
Given that they book you into a course a maximum of 4 weeks away from the free seminar, you can see how disingenuous this policy is.
If you want to get your deposit back, you have only a week and have to send them a letter by registered mail.
I just wrote off the deposit and cancelled my credit card after being told that they were going to charge me for the entire
course regardless of whether I wished to cancel or not.
As I believe someone else has already pointed out, there are far cheaper ways to learn about trading than going with these fools.
Incidentally, one of the things that tipped me off to them being suspicious is that they immediately emailed me an ad for a Tony Robbins course. For those of you not familiar with Tony Robbins, he is a lifestyle ‘guru’ who claims that everyone who does his course will be able to achieve their full potential and become a millionaire after doing a 2 day course which costs thousands of pounds, a business model very similar to the one being peddled by knowledge to action in my opinion.
To be fair, you did hand over a deposit which they do describe as non-refundable. I took this course, as Kevin Redfern stated above, a couple of years ago and am now a full-time trader based on what they taught me. It sounds as though you did not do the course itself, you are just unhappy with the T’s & C’s relating to the return of your deposit. Whether or not these seem draconian (and my guess is that K2A would say that they have not filled your place on the course elsewhere as they had reserved it for you, hence your deposit being non-refundable; when I paid my £500 they certainly made it clear to me that it was one-way, which was fair enough as they stated it verbally and it was on the paperwork), so at least don’t rubbish the course without having taken it.
I don’t know who Tony Robbins is but again, the fact that they emailed you some blurb about him does not automatically make their Forex course rubbish?
One could equally suggest that you calling K2A fools because they did not want to return a non-refundable deposit suggests that your own opinion is not without bias.
Ftr when I took the seminar I was offered a number of course dates, some of which were months from the seminar date, and certainly not just within the four weeks you suggest.
I know that not all courses suit everybody, we all learn differently. I am not employed by K2A, I am just a happy customer and I am speaking up as I wanted to introduce some balance to this, as much of the bashing they receive does not stand up to scrutiny.
ST
training, schmaining… i can sell you a couple of fxmen nudey posters and a box that is cram packed full of commdollies for twenty bucks. who needs training when you have all of that? all sales are final. no refunds…
yay.
You are quite correct, I have not done the course and I’m glad that it worked for you. Personally, I got very spooked after reading various reviews on the internet. It is entirely possible I over-reacted, I am only human after all.
I would be very interested to hear more about your opinions of the course. Do you think it was good value for money? I was personally disquieted by two things. 1. That they wanted me to pay $120 a month for a software package and data stream that according to many comments I have read can be had for much cheaper (or indeed free) and 2. The fact that they are still recommending MF Global as a broker after all the scandal surrounding it, however, that does not actually reflect negatively on them, per se.
I don’t know who Tony Robbins is but again, the fact that they emailed you some blurb about him does not automatically make their Forex course rubbish?
Again, also true. However, unlike this course, I have had experience with courses from Tony Robbins and can verify that in my opinion, they are a 100% gold plated scam.
One could equally suggest that you calling K2A fools because they did not want to return a non-refundable deposit suggests that your own opinion is not without bias.
You are quite correct. The original post was written when my blood was up and you are quite right to correct me on that point. I do apologise.
Ftr when I took the seminar I was offered a number of course dates, some of which were months from the seminar date, and certainly not just within the four weeks you suggest.
When I did the course, I was offered only two dates, both of which were within 5 weeks of the free seminar as far as I remember.
I know that not all courses suit everybody, we all learn differently. I am not employed by K2A, I am just a happy customer and I am speaking up as I wanted to introduce some balance to this, as much of the bashing they receive does not stand up to scrutiny.
In that case, I am very glad you replied to this post. My original post was based very much on a feeling of fear at being taken for a ride, which doesn’t feel good and it’s quite possible I over-reacted.
However, when I did the free course, I was told that I was being offered a once in a lifetime discount to be one of 50 people that would do video testimonials for their launch into South Africa. I was also led to believe that the course was usually charged at over $10,000 and that I was getting a great deal paying only $2k as I have read from other posts in this forum, this is clearly not true and something they have told many other people.
Again, Thanks very much for your reply and also for pointing out the errors in my original post. =)
Dev
Dev,
I would always take internet reviews with a pinch of salt - unhappy people tend to shout much louder than happy ones, in my experience of life, in all areas not just trading, so even 100 negative reviews might be far outweighed by any company’s thousands of happy customers, no way to know. Trouble is, these days we assume that we can know everything, be sure of everything in advance, because we have global communications; unfortunately we often still have to just trust our instincts and take a punt. Not meaning that to sound at all patronizing. A good example of what I mean is film or game reviews. I have an Xbox 360 and love films - when looking to buy a new game or film, I find both five and one star reviews for the same item. Some say that Red Dead Redemption is boring as anything, others think it is among the greatest games ever - both are right, for their own personality. All I am saying is that the internet provides great information and facts, but is less reliable for the subjective stuff. Anyway, am rambling, sorry.
On those two points: 1) I’m guessing you mean eSignal for the charting? Mine costs just under GBP100 pcm. Yes, they recommend eSignal, that is because K2A have done a deal with them whereby if you order eSignal through the K2A website then your eSignal feed comes bundled with the software and layout to suit the three principal, original K2A strategies, so when you open up your charting package your screen will already have the stuff on it (various lines, basically!) that makes the three core strategies very easy to apply to your charting software. However, any charting package will work with the K2A strategies; assuming the package you opted for were flexible enough you could replicate the K2A eSignal screen closely enough to give you what you need, I expect. Equally, the lines are not essential, they just make it easier to see when the core strategies are giving you a setup, particularly when starting out. I am two years in but have stuck with eSignal (although my screen looks quite different from when I started out as I have started to apply my own style to the stuff I was taught) as I prefer to stick with what I know and, having trialled a few alternatives, I just prefer the look, feel, stability, speed and flexibility of eSignal. And to be honest, without wishing to sound flash, the cost disappears in the context of my trading results. At the end of the day, that is basically my only ongoing cost which for a career with this sort of income potential is kind of amazing. So basically eSignal makes implementation of the strategies easier at first, and is a great package, but you could go without it and pick up one of the freebies, it would just make it harder to ‘see’ the setups on the screen, particularly at first. 2) When I started, K2A were recommending ‘one of the bigger, more stable brokers’, then the blurb underneath recommended ETX Capital first, then MF Global. I asked the trainers and they all said ETX Capital were the best. I went with them, am delighted with the service across the board so am still with them. If K2A are still recommending MF Global then I assume that that is a hangover from before they went bust, and is obviously a mistake/a shame and I can see why that would rattle your confidence. As far as I know there is no formal relationship between MF Global and K2A, and presumably whoever is still recommending MF Global will get a clip round the ear, any literature still recommending them will be changed, all of that. I guess noone saw it coming, but you are quite right to say that it is poor for K2A not to have adapted their pitch. Guess we all make mistakes? Not defending it, though.
And to answer your general question yes, I think that it was good value for money. I realize that it is expensive, but I was 35 when I took the course, looking to change career (my previous one was not compatible with the needs of a young family and I wanted to be around for that) so I figured that I was investing in something that I would be doing for decades. I knew nothing about trading before I took the course - my wife works in the City and was mailshotted by K2A, she suggested that I go along to the free seminar. We had just sold a house, so had some cash, so decided to use some of it to speculate. We built a villa in Portugal with some of it, and spent some of the remainder on K2A coaching and seeding my trading account. I have made back my original investment in K2A, so am ahead on the course fees. I am consistently profitable in my trading, I earn more than I used to earn when I worked full time, and I still have time to do the kids’ school runs, go to school plays, get on with other stuff during the day… in short, it is giving us exactly what we wanted it to when we signed me up. We have twice put extra funds into my trading account as we realized that the percentage return I was making made the decision a no-brainer. So while I know that it was a lot of money, and I went in without knowing for sure that it would work, and I am sure that it does not work for everybody - it takes an awful lot of time to get consistent, and to understand why the market reacts the way it does to what you are doing, but the underlying strategies do work - but in our case, with hindsight, we would happily do exactly the same again. If it had cost double I would still be ahead, two years in.
I obviously can’t comment on the relationship as I have not heard of him outside of this thread but I am sorry that it put you off K2A - I have never heard him mentioned in their offices, during their webinars etc.
We all have moments like that, I am sorry if I was blunt in response. I hurt my back quite badly last week and am in constant pain when sitting at the computer at the moment so am, perhaps, not as even-tempered at the moment as I would like to think I am normally. I’m ‘only’ 37 so not used to back pain!! So apology accepted and reciprocated unreservedly if I could have worded my response more gently.
I expect that they would have been able to offer more had you interrogated them on this and they realized that they would have lost the business by putting you under a deadline, as long as you negotiated it before handing over any money - I actually ended up moving my course dates forwards as I had an unexpected window of opportunity. There were many, many dates available when I took it, I don’t know why you were given such a small selection, obviously. It is a shame that this limited your faith in them - a number of different people do the seminars, so all I can think is that some are better than others? That is not an excuse, but certainly on this point my experience is entirely at odds with yours, the crew I dealt with could not have been more flexible/helpful. After all, I was worth money to them, so I am surprised that they were not more accommodating of you, particularly in the current climate.
It’s easy to feel uncertain when trying something new, particularly with money or safety on the line, I have been through both a number of times (my wife and I have built property overseas, which has a similar psychology to it, and I am ex-law enforcement, so am familiar with being in an intimidating or potentially out of control situation) so I completely understand. I have moments of overreaction, however much I kick myself with the boot of hindsight afterwards!
Firstly, I would not describe the free seminar as a course; some do, and that immediately sets up some disappointment. You won’t learn anything there that one could trade, so for me it is more like an open-day where they talk to you a little about what it is to be a trader, and how they might go about teaching you that in detail, and what you can expect. I have heard the testimonial story before - although not with the SA twist, although that likely just dates me as K2A are opening an office/training centre/trading floor in SA, I hear - but to me it was pitched as to get the discount one had to sign up to giving K2A the right to use you as a testimonial if things went well. So a slightly different slant on it - it was quite clear to me that they were offering the discount to get signatures/deposits on the day, and just wanted the chance of some testimonials in their back pocket.
When first launched, years ago (don’t recall when, offhand, although years before my time) the course was more expensive. I paid just under GBP2000 for the course plus three coaching sessions. I then purchased a further year’s coaching on top once my original run of three ran out. Forget exactly what I paid to the penny, but I think the coaching was around £1700? So I am in for c.£3700 total. The extra coaching also included a year’s access to their weekly online webinar (which brought me on no end) and sight of a cross-section of the trades being placed by the K2A trader coaches real time (ie. they can’t fake the results).
Anyway, apologies for the extreme length of this response, I seem to have gone into an extreme ramble (even by my standards, and I do tend to use long sentences, sorry…) but I hope that that answers your questions. I would like to apologize again if I came across harshly yesterday.
ST
You may be rambling a bit, but you do make a good point. =)
On those two points: 1) I’m guessing you mean eSignal for the charting? Mine costs just under GBP100 pcm. Yes, they recommend eSignal, that is because K2A have done a deal with them whereby if you order eSignal through the K2A website then your eSignal feed comes bundled with the software and layout to suit the three principal, original K2A strategies, so when you open up your charting package your screen will already have the stuff on it (various lines, basically!) that makes the three core strategies very easy to apply to your charting software. However, any charting package will work with the K2A strategies; assuming the package you opted for were flexible enough you could replicate the K2A eSignal screen closely enough to give you what you need, I expect. Equally, the lines are not essential, they just make it easier to see when the core strategies are giving you a setup, particularly when starting out. I am two years in but have stuck with eSignal (although my screen looks quite different from when I started out as I have started to apply my own style to the stuff I was taught) as I prefer to stick with what I know and, having trialled a few alternatives, I just prefer the look, feel, stability, speed and flexibility of eSignal. And to be honest, without wishing to sound flash, the cost disappears in the context of my trading results. At the end of the day, that is basically my only ongoing cost which for a career with this sort of income potential is kind of amazing. So basically eSignal makes implementation of the strategies easier at first, and is a great package, but you could go without it and pick up one of the freebies, it would just make it harder to ‘see’ the setups on the screen, particularly at first.
Well this is the other thing that I was worried about. When I did the free seminar, he showed us one of the strategies (I think it was switch-back) and there were a bunch of entry points plotted. Then I read, on this forum actually, that someone had said that the strategy hardly ever gives them entry points and I wondered if the reason I saw so many at the seminar is because of the massive volatility in todays markets, which will not last forever (I hope)
Would you say in your experience that the eSignal strategies give enough entry and exit points to continually trade in a variety of market conditions?
- When I started, K2A were recommending ‘one of the bigger, more stable brokers’, then the blurb underneath recommended ETX Capital first, then MF Global. I asked the trainers and they all said ETX Capital were the best. I went with them, am delighted with the service across the board so am still with them. If K2A are still recommending MF Global then I assume that that is a hangover from before they went bust, and is obviously a mistake/a shame and I can see why that would rattle your confidence. As far as I know there is no formal relationship between MF Global and K2A, and presumably whoever is still recommending MF Global will get a clip round the ear, any literature still recommending them will be changed, all of that. I guess noone saw it coming, but you are quite right to say that it is poor for K2A not to have adapted their pitch. Guess we all make mistakes? Not defending it, though.
Yeah, you are probably right. The promotional literature was probably written well before the bust of MF Global, in hindsight, but yeah, it didn’t exactly fill me with confidence.
And to answer your general question yes, I think that it was good value for money. I realize that it is expensive, but I was 35 when I took the course, looking to change career (my previous one was not compatible with the needs of a young family and I wanted to be around for that) so I figured that I was investing in something that I would be doing for decades. I knew nothing about trading before I took the course - my wife works in the City and was mailshotted by K2A, she suggested that I go along to the free seminar. We had just sold a house, so had some cash, so decided to use some of it to speculate. We built a villa in Portugal with some of it, and spent some of the remainder on K2A coaching and seeding my trading account. I have made back my original investment in K2A, so am ahead on the course fees. I am consistently profitable in my trading, I earn more than I used to earn when I worked full time, and I still have time to do the kids’ school runs, go to school plays, get on with other stuff during the day… in short, it is giving us exactly what we wanted it to when we signed me up. We have twice put extra funds into my trading account as we realized that the percentage return I was making made the decision a no-brainer. So while I know that it was a lot of money, and I went in without knowing for sure that it would work, and I am sure that it does not work for everybody - it takes an awful lot of time to get consistent, and to understand why the market reacts the way it does to what you are doing, but the underlying strategies do work - but in our case, with hindsight, we would happily do exactly the same again. If it had cost double I would still be ahead, two years in.
Your words have definitely given me something to think about. To be honest, I still have a week until the course starts, so I could easily still do it. I wanted to ring them up and discuss my concerns, but the phone number given to me buy the guy at the seminar was disconnected (yet another thing that made me antenna twitch, as it were) thought I suppose really it would be best to get in touch with the student management people…
I obviously can’t comment on the relationship as I have not heard of him outside of this thread but I am sorry that it put you off K2A - I have never heard him mentioned in their offices, during their webinars etc.
Yeah, I had a very bad experience at one of his seminars during a mass hypnosis session which triggered a seizure. A very unpleasant experience. The way they reacted to it as well showed they were much more concerned about keeping their reputation than actually helping the people involved. Obviously they are not the same company as K2A, but they could hardly have sent me an ad that would have made me more suspicious than that one. Ofc, that may but be coincidence.
We all have moments like that, I am sorry if I was blunt in response. I hurt my back quite badly last week and am in constant pain when sitting at the computer at the moment so am, perhaps, not as even-tempered at the moment as I would like to think I am normally. I’m ‘only’ 37 so not used to back pain!! So apology accepted and reciprocated unreservedly if I could have worded my response more gently.
No, actually I thought your response was very good actually. You pointed out a number of inaccuracies in my original post and you were quite right to do so. As far as the back pain, you have my sympathies, my wife has two prolapsed disks and I have to care for her constantly, so I know a thing or two about that particular monster.
I expect that they would have been able to offer more had you interrogated them on this and they realized that they would have lost the business by putting you under a deadline, as long as you negotiated it before handing over any money - I actually ended up moving my course dates forwards as I had an unexpected window of opportunity. There were many, many dates available when I took it, I don’t know why you were given such a small selection, obviously. It is a shame that this limited your faith in them - a number of different people do the seminars, so all I can think is that some are better than others? That is not an excuse, but certainly on this point my experience is entirely at odds with yours, the crew I dealt with could not have been more flexible/helpful. After all, I was worth money to them, so I am surprised that they were not more accommodating of you, particularly in the current climate.
To be honest, I didn’t really give them much of a chance. I should at least give them a call and see what they have to say. The person I talked to was on their financial team and might not have known what they were talking about.
It’s easy to feel uncertain when trying something new, particularly with money or safety on the line, I have been through both a number of times (my wife and I have built property overseas, which has a similar psychology to it, and I am ex-law enforcement, so am familiar with being in an intimidating or potentially out of control situation) so I completely understand. I have moments of overreaction, however much I kick myself with the boot of hindsight afterwards!
I am beginning to feel like this may have been one of those moments for me. <ahem> =)
Firstly, I would not describe the free seminar as a course; some do, and that immediately sets up some disappointment. You won’t learn anything there that one could trade, so for me it is more like an open-day where they talk to you a little about what it is to be a trader, and how they might go about teaching you that in detail, and what you can expect. I have heard the testimonial story before - although not with the SA twist, although that likely just dates me as K2A are opening an office/training centre/trading floor in SA, I hear - but to me it was pitched as to get the discount one had to sign up to giving K2A the right to use you as a testimonial if things went well. So a slightly different slant on it - it was quite clear to me that they were offering the discount to get signatures/deposits on the day, and just wanted the chance of some testimonials in their back pocket.
Well, yes, to be frank, this is what really made me suspicious. I was sent an email saying that I was getting a 13k course for only 3k but I have yet to hear of anyone actually paying more than 3k, so it would seem that it’s a slightly dodgy marketing tactic.
When first launched, years ago (don’t recall when, offhand, although years before my time) the course was more expensive. I paid just under GBP2000 for the course plus three coaching sessions. I then purchased a further year’s coaching on top once my original run of three ran out. Forget exactly what I paid to the penny, but I think the coaching was around £1700? So I am in for c.£3700 total. The extra coaching also included a year’s access to their weekly online webinar (which brought me on no end) and sight of a cross-section of the trades being placed by the K2A trader coaches real time (ie. they can’t fake the results).
No, that’s pretty much what they are charging now, in fact I think yours was probably a bit cheaper.
Anyway, apologies for the extreme length of this response, I seem to have gone into an extreme ramble (even by my standards, and I do tend to use long sentences, sorry…) but I hope that that answers your questions. I would like to apologize again if I came across harshly yesterday.
No, thank you very much. Like I said, you have given me alot to think about. I was originally prepared to just walk away, but I think I will now give them a call and see what they have to say. It’s still a week to the course date, so I could still go.
I really appreciate you taking the time to respond in such a detailed way. For me, the money for this course is a serious amount of cash. I understand that the best education cannot turn a fool into a genius, I just want to be sure that the educaton is worth what I am paying for it.
Thanks again Simon. I wish you well.
Dev
Lol, guilty as charged on the first bit, thank you for the second part.
This is a big decision, and unfortunately it is impossible to know for sure which is the right way to jump ahead of time. But in case it helps, my personal opinion on the points you raised (with the caveat that you don’t know that I am not a complete idiot), at risk of rambling even worse than last time, is:
Snapback, I think you mean? That is one of the newer strategies; on top of the three original strategies (which are still taught and traded), they have added a few new ones during the past two years to account for different market types (they are constantly backtesting, one of the things they do on the trading floor) which they now trade alongside the original strategies; broadly, the newer stuff is shorter-term than the traditional stuff. I started with no trading knowledge whatsoever; one thing I liked about this course is that it included a crash course in PA and TA, so during the subsequent webinars and coaching sessions they bring on TA and PA skills as well as the basic strategies. During coaching, the coaches will discuss whatever aspect of the trading you want, whether that be the strats themselves, psychology, PA, just going through your trading log, whatever. I saw the same comment on this forum (can’t remember where, offhand, but we obviously read the same thing) - I was surprised at it, to be honest. The current market is volatile, no question, so I would say that many trading styles are finding the times leaner than normal, and that includes me. In ‘normal running’, there are a lot of setups that suit, more than I (or most people) would want to take as one would be overexposed to the market. K2A teach a mix of end of day trading and intraday trading, very short-term trades and longer term stuff. Everyone finds their own preference. Mine is for medium-long. The end of day stuff, in particular, is tougher at the moment, but still giving setups, they just aren’t playing out as predictably as normal. But I still took three end of day setups this week, all paid out at better than 1:1 - scale that up over the month and I have a double-digit percentage return just off end of day this month, and that is in the current conditions. There are still setups at the moment, not as many as normal but restricting oneself to the quality-looking ones, and following the K2A money management advice, means that it should still pay. It certainly has for me. I have added in some pure PA trading over the past two years as my confidence and knowledge has grown, but I mostly trade the K2A strategies and make a good profit on them.
I should say that not all the strategies were included in my basic course. I have picked up a couple of the others during the subsequent webinars and in coaching (I only did the basic course). I do not know how many/which strategies are taught in the current incarnation of my course.
K2A’s approach is not fundamental trading, it is largely technical. The strategies they teach can be applied to trending markets (they work great when it is trending) but also to ranging markets, when it is volatile; it is tough to describe, but the longer I immersed myself in what they say, the more I studied the weekly webinar, the more I felt equipped to understand what I as looking at and make money from it. It is tougher when the market is tough, obviously, but that is not restricted to K2A.
I can see that - definitely a mistake on their part, no updating their literature, if that is what happened.
Well obviously you don’t know me, so you won’t sign up because of my couple of posts, and you have clearly not liked everything you have seen so far. It took me a few months to become profitable, and to read around the subject enough to have the confidence to let trades run etc., immediately after the course I just took losses and thought ‘I’ve made a mistake’. But within the first year I was stringing together profitable months, and now I am utterly convinced that I will be a trader for life. But obviously make your own decision, I don’t want you shouting at me if you attend the course and for whatever reason don’t like it lol!! We’re all different, but I credit them with taking me from ‘knows nothing’ to ‘consistently profitable full time trader’ in under a year. I really don’t think that I am a prodigy, so I have to credit K2A with that lol. But obviously make your own decision… I don’t trade others’ money, I don’t work for anyone, I get no commission if you do go with K2A, I am just giving you my personal opinion. Sorry if that sounds like a legal disclaimer, but I want to be honest and clear. I don’t know your history, knowledge base, preferred learning style, any of that, I just know that K2A suited mine.
As for the number not working, there could be any reason, the member of staff might have moved on, anything, but obviously it is pretty poor not to give you the new number.
Cripes!! I have never been hypnotized and don’t intend to be, so am not surprised that you have somewhat gone of them.
Phew, thank you! And at risk of coming across as a stalker, this is getting slightly strange: my wife suffered two prolapsed discs a few years back, sequential ones in her upper spine, comfortably the most horrific episode in our lives, very sorry to hear that you are going through similar. Won’t go into it too much on an open forum, but suffice to say we used to get very down about it - as you will know, many of the conventional treatments aren’t possible when it is two discs - then we (finally) found a different doctor who made some life-changing progress with it. Without wishing to intrude (and obviously ignore this bit if you wish), if you want to PM me I would gladly give you his details, in case the issues are similar. My own back is currently painful but mercifully not a permanent issue, it popped back in on its own before doing too much damage (as painful as it sounds, though…!) so I try not to moan too much at home, for obvious reasons.
Lol, most of us have them from time to time!
Not at all, my pleasure. I would certainly call someone on the training side and see how they sound. Trading has changed my life, I receive a lot of support from key family, friends, this site and my coach, and I am always very happy to offer similar support to others. As I say, though, as far as you know I could be a complete nutter, so please don’t sign up just because I say I like them!!!
I completely get the uncertainty that comes from the unclear pricing. K2A do run more than one course, including coaching stocks trading, so I don’t know all the courses they offer.
If you decide not to pay for formal training, this site is as good a free resource as exists, imho, so start with a small stake and pick up the skills from here. My own opinion is that that would take longer, and is the more stressful route, but that is a separate debate that divides opinion on here from time to time…
(And to pick up one point made elsewhere in this thread, regarding Greg Secker’s nationality, I don’t know but wiki says that he is English and he certainly sounds English to me - not that it matters, but I would be surprised if he turned out to be South African, purely going by those two observations)
Sorry for the extreme length of this, hopefully it gives you another opinion to consider in framing your thoughts.
ST
I don’t know if this is to off topic but I found Chris Lori to be an awesome teacher. Even now with my experience level I will probably buy his new AUD/JPY course. I wen through his pro trader course a while back and it was packed full of great content.
Just my two cents
Hehe, I know what you mean, but the tendency to ramble can often contain many fruitful bits of wisdom, your rambling certainly has… =)
Snapback, I think you mean? That is one of the newer strategies; on top of the three original strategies (which are still taught and traded), they have added a few new ones during the past two years to account for different market types (they are constantly backtesting, one of the things they do on the trading floor) which they now trade alongside the original strategies; broadly, the newer stuff is shorter-term than the traditional stuff. I started with no trading knowledge whatsoever; one thing I liked about this course is that it included a crash course in PA and TA, so during the subsequent webinars and coaching sessions they bring on TA and PA skills as well as the basic strategies. During coaching, the coaches will discuss whatever aspect of the trading you want, whether that be the strats themselves, psychology, PA, just going through your trading log, whatever. I saw the same comment on this forum (can’t remember where, offhand, but we obviously read the same thing) - I was surprised at it, to be honest. The current market is volatile, no question, so I would say that many trading styles are finding the times leaner than normal, and that includes me. In ‘normal running’, there are a lot of setups that suit, more than I (or most people) would want to take as one would be overexposed to the market. K2A teach a mix of end of day trading and intraday trading, very short-term trades and longer term stuff. Everyone finds their own preference. Mine is for medium-long. The end of day stuff, in particular, is tougher at the moment, but still giving setups, they just aren’t playing out as predictably as normal. But I still took three end of day setups this week, all paid out at better than 1:1 - scale that up over the month and I have a double-digit percentage return just off end of day this month, and that is in the current conditions. There are still setups at the moment, not as many as normal but restricting oneself to the quality-looking ones, and following the K2A money management advice, means that it should still pay. It certainly has for me. I have added in some pure PA trading over the past two years as my confidence and knowledge has grown, but I mostly trade the K2A strategies and make a good profit on them.
I should say that not all the strategies were included in my basic course. I have picked up a couple of the others during the subsequent webinars and in coaching (I only did the basic course). I do not know how many/which strategies are taught in the current incarnation of my course.
K2A’s approach is not fundamental trading, it is largely technical. The strategies they teach can be applied to trending markets (they work great when it is trending) but also to ranging markets, when it is volatile; it is tough to describe, but the longer I immersed myself in what they say, the more I studied the weekly webinar, the more I felt equipped to understand what I as looking at and make money from it. It is tougher when the market is tough, obviously, but that is not restricted to K2A.
If it’s not too much of a personal question, how much more did you spend with them for extra training after the original course? and did you find the tutors that took you for the 3 hours of face to face time after the two day course were competent?
Well obviously you don’t know me, so you won’t sign up because of my couple of posts, and you have clearly not liked everything you have seen so far. It took me a few months to become profitable, and to read around the subject enough to have the confidence to let trades run etc., immediately after the course I just took losses and thought ‘I’ve made a mistake’. But within the first year I was stringing together profitable months, and now I am utterly convinced that I will be a trader for life. But obviously make your own decision, I don’t want you shouting at me if you attend the course and for whatever reason don’t like it lol!! We’re all different, but I credit them with taking me from ‘knows nothing’ to ‘consistently profitable full time trader’ in under a year. I really don’t think that I am a prodigy, so I have to credit K2A with that lol. But obviously make your own decision… I don’t trade others’ money, I don’t work for anyone, I get no commission if you do go with K2A, I am just giving you my personal opinion. Sorry if that sounds like a legal disclaimer, but I want to be honest and clear. I don’t know your history, knowledge base, preferred learning style, any of that, I just know that K2A suited mine.
Well, see this is exactly the thing. I really want a course that will allow me to trade sooner rather than later and make a profit. I dont believe I am a prodigy either, but I am a reasonably intelligent individual, so I am relatively confident that as long as the system is not inherently crooked, I could make it work. Also, i’m sure having access to a forum like babypips and minds such as yours would help me minimise my mistakes or at the very least understand and learn from them.
As for the number not working, there could be any reason, the member of staff might have moved on, anything, but obviously it is pretty poor not to give you the new number.
Exactly. Its pretty much one of those situation where a series of random events builds up to give you a picture that may be much more negative than it really is. =)
Cripes!! I have never been hypnotized and don’t intend to be, so am not surprised that you have somewhat gone of them.
Indeed. It is IMHO, the hight of folly to hypnotise a room full of three hundred people with the same script, since you never know what psychological traumas may be triggered by such a script. But again, that’s what you get from Tony Robbins. He essentially implies that if you do his course, then everyone who does it will be as rich as he is. I’m sure you can see the immediate fallacies in such an idea… =)
Phew, thank you! And at risk of coming across as a stalker, this is getting slightly strange: my wife suffered two prolapsed discs a few years back, sequential ones in her upper spine, comfortably the most horrific episode in our lives, very sorry to hear that you are going through similar. Won’t go into it too much on an open forum, but suffice to say we used to get very down about it - as you will know, many of the conventional treatments aren’t possible when it is two discs - then we (finally) found a different doctor who made some life-changing progress with it. Without wishing to intrude (and obviously ignore this bit if you wish), if you want to PM me I would gladly give you his details, in case the issues are similar. My own back is currently painful but mercifully not a permanent issue, it popped back in on its own before doing too much damage (as painful as it sounds, though…!) so I try not to moan too much at home, for obvious reasons.
Wow. that is a rather bizarre coincidence actually… =) My wife has two adjacent ones in her lower back, which has basically kept her bedridden for the past three months. However, we have found a very good osteopath who uses laser light of all things. (I know, it sounds totally junk science, but apparently, certain wavelengths stimulate the production of ATP in cells and thus cause the growth of more muscle tissue, which allows him to selectively strengthen certain parts of the back musculature.
I will definitely PM you and if for any reason you need the details of my doctor, I would be happy to let you know. =)
Not at all, my pleasure. I would certainly call someone on the training side and see how they sound. Trading has changed my life, I receive a lot of support from key family, friends, this site and my coach, and I am always very happy to offer similar support to others. As I say, though, as far as you know I could be a complete nutter, so please don’t sign up just because I say I like them!!!
If you decide not to pay for formal training, this site is as good a free resource as exists, imho, so start with a small stake and pick up the skills from here. My own opinion is that that would take longer, and is the more stressful route, but that is a separate debate that divides opinion on here from time to time…
Well yeah, as I said before, I would really like to start trading profitably sooner rather than later. I think on balance I will do the course, dont worry though, I would never blame someone else for a decision I have made. I have found it’s generally a bad way to live your life. =)
Thanks again for all the time and effort you have put into answering my questions… I am very happy to have found a community like babypips and I look forward to actually making some damn pips… =)
Sorry for the extreme length of this, hopefully it gives you another opinion to consider in framing your thoughts.
No need to apologise. As I said, I really appreciate that you would take the time to talk to me, given that you do not know me from a bar of soap. Take care of yourself, best of luck to your wife, and I’ll let the forum know how the course goes.
One More question actually, before I go… $120 a month does seem like alot to pay for a datafeed for eSignal. Is it worth the investment, in your opinion?
Thanks again.
Dev.
Lol. Not too personal at all - I paid just under £2k for the original course including the three sessions, then I think (from memory!) that it was around £1500 +VAT (old rate at the time so came to £1700-odd) for twelve further coaching sessions. I am a few hundred shy of £4k all in, that is not exact, but in the ballpark. Obviously this is from over a year ago, I do not know whether or not the costs have changed.
The coaching sessions are 30 minutes each, though, so it was 1½ hours of coaching lumped in with the course fee.
The coaching sessions were all one on one with the same coach. I liked him, he’s a seriously talented trader (to the point of still occasionally finding it humbling lol) so when I signed up for extra coaching I stayed with him, so I can’t say whether he is representative of the others but I consider him worth every penny I paid. The improvements he made to my trading paid for the coaching sessions, no question. But of course, I might have been rubbish in the first place!! I can only speak for myself. I have heard several of the other coaches in the weekly webinars, they each have their own style but have all seemed to know what they are doing on there - I have only been coached by the one, though, so I am not much use as a review of their coaching across the board, I am afraid.
That is exactly how I thought of it. We were lucky in that we had, at the time, done up and sold a house and made slightly more than anticipated, so in a sense we had a little unexpected cash that felt like ‘free’ money. So we bought the course conscious that it was a punt that might not work out (I had no relevant experience whatsoever, so even if K2A had been good, I could have turned out to be the weak link). So all I can say is, like trading funds, be prepared to lose the money. That does not sound like a very positive attitude, but it is realistic and, like any new venture, there is a chance that trading just does not work out for whatever reason. I am confident now, but at the time I had no real idea whether it would work, whether I would be any good at it or whether K2A would be worth the money. This is all very personal stuff, we each of us run our own household finances our own way and make the calls as we see them, knowing that we won’t always be right. Sorry not to be able to be more definitive!! I was prepared to write off the money, but it turned out to be an investment that we are very happy with, that’s all I can say.
It is bizarre, yes - you’re the first person I have ‘met’ with experience of the same, adjacent disc issue. My wife’s doctor’s solution sounds different from yours, so could be worth looking into (although obviously I am [I]not[/I] a doctor), we found that there was no such thing as too many different ideas. My wife was off work for months with it, but can now work, drive, 99% of the time you’d never know we had the issue, so do drop me a PM, you never know. And your solution doesn’t sound junk science at all - in our experience, a lot of the conventional stuff failed to address this issue, so my wife’s specialist got pretty creative and it worked out better than we could have expected. All makes me feel a bit of a wimp for complaining about my single disc issue!
Not at all. This site is great. I hear you on wanting to be profitable early. There was a time when I had forked out for the course, and the coaching, and had lost money in my live account and I wondered whether I had been sold a pup. But nearly two years in I’m still here and loving it; I was just very green and it took me some time to really get my head around the concepts. When I started I just tended to take the setups in a bubble, not looking at any other factors. These days, I see the setups, but am better at spotting what reasons there might be not to take them. That filtering made the difference between losses and profits.
On the eSignal costs yes, it is expensive. We started out with eSignal as the K2A proprietary charting was embedded and we wanted to make sure that I was learning correctly and making life as easy as possible for myself. Our original plan was to move to a cheaper/free service after a few months. But to be honest, I am very happy with the platform, and the monthly cost is now less than the 1% I risk per trade, so I decided I was happier not messing about with something that was working. My wife was kind enough to let me fund the eSignal cost from our joint account for the first year, so it was not a millstone on my trading. So to us it was worth it, and it is a great package, but tbh I have never tried one of the freebies so can’t really give you a comparison.
Good luck with it all and do drop me a line ref the back stuff, my wife’s specialist might have some interesting insights.
ST
Hey Simon, I just paid the last of my money to enrol in this weekend’s course and laster in the day something struck me…
If the course is on the weekend, the markets will be closed, wont they? In which case how are they supposed to show you any live trading?
Or am I misunderstanding the way the course works and do they mentor you in live trading only after the 2 day course? That seems a bit suspect…? I was looking at the requirement that I have an open trading account to attend the course, when it hit me that there wouldnt be any open markets to trade over the weekend.
Any ideas?
Well I definitely hope it’s all worth it… I must say, i’m, quite looking forward to it. I saw their office / trading floor today and it does look quite impressive…
That is exactly how I thought of it. We were lucky in that we had, at the time, done up and sold a house and made slightly more than anticipated, so in a sense we had a little unexpected cash that felt like ‘free’ money. So we bought the course conscious that it was a punt that might not work out (I had no relevant experience whatsoever, so even if K2A had been good, I could have turned out to be the weak link). So all I can say is, like trading funds, be prepared to lose the money. That does not sound like a very positive attitude, but it is realistic and, like any new venture, there is a chance that trading just does not work out for whatever reason. I am confident now, but at the time I had no real idea whether it would work, whether I would be any good at it or whether K2A would be worth the money. This is all very personal stuff, we each of us run our own household finances our own way and make the calls as we see them, knowing that we won’t always be right. Sorry not to be able to be more definitive!! I was prepared to write off the money, but it turned out to be an investment that we are very happy with, that’s all I can say.
That’s the way I have been forced to look at it as well, although I really hope it works, since being a trader would very much suit my lifestyle and my hours, since I am having to look after my wife on a long-term basis.
It is bizarre, yes - you’re the first person I have ‘met’ with experience of the same, adjacent disc issue. My wife’s doctor’s solution sounds different from yours, so could be worth looking into (although obviously I am [I]not[/I] a doctor), we found that there was no such thing as too many different ideas. My wife was off work for months with it, but can now work, drive, 99% of the time you’d never know we had the issue, so do drop me a PM, you never know. And your solution doesn’t sound junk science at all - in our experience, a lot of the conventional stuff failed to address this issue, so my wife’s specialist got pretty creative and it worked out better than we could have expected. All makes me feel a bit of a wimp for complaining about my single disc issue!
I’m not exactly sure how to PM you… I went to your profile page and left a hello message, but didn’t get a reply. am I missing something? =)
Not at all. This site is great. I hear you on wanting to be profitable early. There was a time when I had forked out for the course, and the coaching, and had lost money in my live account and I wondered whether I had been sold a pup. But nearly two years in I’m still here and loving it; I was just very green and it took me some time to really get my head around the concepts. When I started I just tended to take the setups in a bubble, not looking at any other factors. These days, I see the setups, but am better at spotting what reasons there might be not to take them. That filtering made the difference between losses and profits.
I must say, i’m looking forward to discussing some of the stuff from the course with you, if you wouldn’t mind… It’s always better to have someone you can ask who actually has a couple of years of real experience under their belt… =)
On the eSignal costs yes, it is expensive. We started out with eSignal as the K2A proprietary charting was embedded and we wanted to make sure that I was learning correctly and making life as easy as possible for myself. Our original plan was to move to a cheaper/free service after a few months. But to be honest, I am very happy with the platform, and the monthly cost is now less than the 1% I risk per trade, so I decided I was happier not messing about with something that was working. My wife was kind enough to let me fund the eSignal cost from our joint account for the first year, so it was not a millstone on my trading. So to us it was worth it, and it is a great package, but tbh I have never tried one of the freebies so can’t really give you a comparison.
Well, I’ll give eSignal a try and see how I go from there. I may as well, since I dont really have any experience with charting software and I can always cancel the monthly subscription if I find something better…=)
Good luck with it all and do drop me a line ref the back stuff, my wife’s specialist might have some interesting insights.
Indeed, send me a private message with your email address and i will happily send you the details of the doctor my wife is using… I must say, I was originally sceptical of his technique, but I have seen him do stuff with that kind of medicine that I would have thought impossible, like close a 10inch wide ulcerated abdominal wound that had been unresponsive to conventional treatment for 7 years… Really amazing stuff…
Like i said, I’m not sure how to send me a private message, so send me one and i can hit you back…
Thanks again for your help and advice.
Dev
Hi Dev,
Yes, the markets would not be open on a weekend; my course and all coaching sessions have been on weekdays.
However, the coaching does take place after the course, yes. The way they break it down is they teach you the strats and what you need to trade them on the course, then you go away and have a go, they assign you a coach and then you book slots in that coach’s diary for your coaching sessions. That split was explained to me during the free seminar in response to a question someone asked.
I had not realized that they ran anything on weekends, but the course itself would work like that: when I did it the course was lots of presentations, mostly backed by powerpoint (or similar, I’m not an IT man!), with some video and Q&A sessions with the tutor. Most of the sessions were with the same guy to give some continuity. He did pull up a few lives charts from time to time to illustrate a point, but it would work without live charting. About half the room had their laptops hooked up real time and were scanning charts as he taught, but I did not as I wanted to focus and frame questions etc. I didn’t place any trades during the day on the course. So mine could have been on a weekend from that point of view.
The end of day aspect to the strategy, though, I did scan for setups that evening (I was in a hotel round the corner!), but that will still work for you - end of day stuff placed over the weekend relies on Friday’s chart, obviously - indeed it gives you an opportunity to spot a setup and then ask about it in the morning without the fear that it will have triggered, so if you have spotted one, placed it, and it turns out to be a bad call you will have time to quietly cancel the order…
For the coaching, I think delegates play it differently: some do it on their own computer, others go through whatever they want to cover on the coach’s system. If you elect to do the coaching in person then you will do it at your coach’s desk. I don’t know about you, but my coach’s system was much better than mine… sigh… I simply emailed across a spreadsheet of my trades ahead of time, we then went through those and anything else I wanted to cover on his desktop.
Even if you decide that you don’t like the course overall, you cannot fail to have your basic understanding of trading improved, your understanding of technical analysis, and personally I always find it inspirational sitting on their trading floor surrounded by full time traders. I always felt more confident just sitting there looking around the room and seeing charts up on every screen. Made me feel like this was a career, not just a hobby I had found on the internet.
It’s the best attitude, imho. And currency trading successfully does give a fantastically flexible lifestyle with a good income. And hopefully your wife’s situation will turn around.
My bad, I had not realized how few posts you have. Apparently one needs a certain number of posts before one is allowed to send PMs - I don’t know the reason for that restriction, and I am afraid that I do not know the level at which PMs kick in. Early on, I think, so keep posting!
We are having a comedy of bad luck, though: I saw your visitor message yesterday, I replied, and I received an error message saying something like ‘BB code not allowed’. I don’t know what that means, I have never had it before, there was no odd attachment in my message, so I have raised a query elsewhere on this site (in ‘bugs and suggestions’) to which I have not yet received a response. When I do, hopefully the system will let my message go, otherwise I will PM you as soon as your post count increases. I am sure that the powers that be will unlock my message to you, though, as I cannot see any reason why it should not have gone. Apologies for the delay and that it looked as though I was ignoring you - not the case!!
No, that would be fine, hopefully you have a few more posts then and we can do it by PM rather than clogging up the site with it.
Exactly the same as me - I figured it was the easiest way to start. If you do want to move there are all sorts of people on this site who can advise on which packages have worked well and which they would advise against, it’s great for stuff like that on here.
My wife is mostly fixed, currently, thank goodness but always grateful for alternative ideas. I will try to find out how many posts you need before you can PM and will post the answer here.
ST
I want to hear from you guys 