Just curious! Was wondering what a broker can see at thier end when a trader uses an EA/indicator. Thanks
2 Likes
I don’t know the answer to this, and i’m also very very curious, so +1 to the question!
I’ve also read a lot into this over the years and you won’t be surprised that it’s a grey area filled with…well basically crap.
From what i’ve gathered, specifically from MetaTrader and no doubt a common theme with all trading software, they can indeed see what you have loaded onto it. There is a backend to all software, an entry point to a programme per se, and EA’s are stored on the trading application (otherwise when you turn your PC off what is going to happen?)
There was even a series of videos showing how brokers can access your EA’s from MetaTrader on youtube, this was removed (banned) within days of it being published. I’ve relentlessly wondered if there is a time and a place, hence now, to develop an addon which has no direct link with MT4/5, cTrader and others which has only one purpose…sending one way signals when certain criteria are met.
I’m yet to find a definite answer to your question, and unless someone speaks up from within the retail industry I highly doubt we will ever know, which is a little concerning.
3 Likes
Perhaps I can help.
Just popped to the brokerage dept and asked.
The answer you’re looking for is:
“just whether the trade is send manually, by mobile device or by EA
nothing else”
P.S That’s the case with an DMA/STP broker. Don’t know if the MM/DD brokers have more of an insight, and I forgot to ask.
This should give you an idea how Market Makers play your positions, SL and TP’s placed from an EA will be targeted as well.
There is a post on BP from a Trader that opened up his own brokerage, who gave a detailed account of how he was offered the Plugin for around $8000 and how it worked, VirtualDealer Plugin…
I’ll have a look for it… See Below for the Arms Dealer to the Brokerage Community…
One of the main reasons I started Trading on the Ctrader Platform which (early releases) was immune to this kind of manipulation… unfortunately from version 3 on a Broker Backend was added…
This discussions already been had so I know @bradley79 won’t agree, probably the reason that both MetaTrader (MT/4/5) and recently Spotware (Ctrader) are based in Cyprus…Regulation Wonderland…
TradingView is probably the only platform that is currently manipulation free at this time…
How experienced Traders here don’t know this goes on is beyond me…
And so the solution to this is what - don’t use a Stop loss?
Or have a stop level in mind, but execute it manually “at market” when the level is reached and accept that you might be too late to get that exact level?
That’s a yes and a couple of no’s.
We’re actually on the same opinion - the MMs may do the stuff. I’ve said that in my comment above as well.
As for the regulation wonderland part - that would be the 1st No. Cyprus is a part of the EU and in the past years, we’ve seen CySEC become increasingly more aggressive when it comes to regulation and EU law application.
The other No - would be the TW part.
They provide a platform, but if the broker to which you send your trades is one that employs the manipulations you’re talking about - it makes no difference. Brokers can apply for a partnership with TW - so, traders can use the TW platform but still have their trades pass through the broker of their choice. Example: TW platform -> JFD Brokers -> Liquidity Provider/Pool. So, your trades will still go through the broker, regardless of the platform, and in the cases where the broker is also the LP (DD/MM license), the outcome will be the same.
That is why I advocate for traders to look for NDD brokers.
Of course… Those videos on YouTube are all made up… that Company selling malevolent Plugins for MT4 is imaginary… The VirtualDealer Plugin is a myth… Most traders here (like 80%+) have no choice than to trade via MM’s and are wide open to this type of manipulation…
"There is no actual people pushing the prices up and down - no thin, no thick. The chart movement is generated by a program that uses current foreign exchange market prices, past chart movement patterns and movement controls to generate an algorithm that drives the movement feeds. The goal is to produce a chart pattern that seems to mimic the live foreign exchange market conditions - but watch it closely and you will notice that the movement follows you…… but we weren’t watching the markets, we were watching a computer program…
This is in addition why some RFED brokers accused and took profits from traders who “injected price” into their platforms – the platform was the market – and some had figured out how to manipulate it to inject a better price (a glitch in the software – much like a video game hack).
The broker claims seemed so ridiculous cause you thought “who could manipulate FOREX from their own platform?” You weren’t, you were just manipulating your own feed…"
Unfortunately… you can count proven NDD Brokers on one hand…
And… No…Both platform providers were Russian based, convenient that both are now inside CySEC.
CySEC is not going to go from the Sheriff of the wild west to a trusted regulatory body overnight…
TradingView hasn’t got page after page across every trading forum and social media outlets from as far back as 2009 warning of the malicious dealer plugins available to brokers offering the MetaTrader product.
Despite the sarcasm, where did you see me disagreeing with that? The answer is nowhere. I do agree on this one.
I have the feeling we’re saying the same things, only differently phrased. And you feel like I am in disagreement for some odd reason…
True. But they are working on it.
Nor will it have. Until it becomes a broker. TW is a tool or an outlet if you will. However, when that tool is connected to a faulty/scam/unreliable utility provider - the result will be the same.
You use the TW platform, but the order execution, transfer and liquidity provider is not picked or provided by them. All of those things are done by the broker to which the TW platform is sending the signals.
Let me try to give an example that would be easier to comprehend:
Broker X has partnered with TW - meaning you can use the TW platform with an account of that broker. So, all your trades will be sent from the TW platform to the broker and from there to the LP.
When the broker is the LP would you say that there is a possibility of malicious activity to occur? Despite you using the TW platform for your trading?
Do not get me wrong. I am all for transparent and fair trading and am not trying to minimize what TW is doing. Nor am I trying to disregard them as reliable. It’s a good start. What I am trying to explain is that regardless of TW being impartial to your trading, they do not handle it. They are just the vessel. It’s up to the ones handling your trades (the broker and LP) to be fair and impartial as well.
Hi @scalpingjack and @BaconSandwich,
Based on our experience as the #1 FX broker in the US by retail client assets and one of the leading brokers worldwide in retail trading volume according to the latest industry reports, we can tell you FOREX.com can see the following when you run an expert advisor (EA) on your MT4 terminal with us:
- Whether a particular order was placed by an EA or placed manually.
- The Magic number
- Any comments sent out by the EA when the order was placed. (Note, if you coded the EA yourself, you can determine what information is included in these comments.)
As your MT4 broker, we cannot see the following:
- The code of your EA.
- The reason(s) why your EA placed the order.
Hi John,
Trading with a well-regulated broker can go a long way towards addressing the concerns you raised about market maker execution.
However, based on your comments, you might be more interested in our new Direct Market Access (DMA) account designed for high volume traders (100K minimum trade size).
1 Like
Hi @BaconSandwich,
As stated in our post above, as your MT4 broker, we cannot see the code of your EA. If you are running an EA on an MT4 terminal on your PC, and you turn off your PC, then your EA will stop running.
That’s why we have often said it’s worth considering a virtual private server (VPS) to keep your EA and MT4 terminal running 24 hours a day during the trading week, even if your own PC is turned off.
Ah right I see - I had no idea you have to leave your PC on. Then again, I’ve never used an EA. I still phone up for a good chinwag before finally putting the phone down because I’ve forgotten what I called the broker for in the first place. With that being said I can now totally see the advantage of using an EA for entry and exit.
1 Like
I think they can see if ea open trades and also set target profit, but they not know what kinds code inside the ea, if ea run profit consistently might as market maker broker blocked account or these accounts will face with a problem