Hello Presswood!
Any updates on trying etoro? If there on social trading did you had any luck with their platforms?
Thanks,
I’m sorry, but I had to turn that dribble off after idiots started trying to quote the 1st amendment gives them the right to freedom of speech.
The 1st amendment has no legal or consitutional validity anywhere in the world outside of the US. Etoro being based in Cyprus means they have no obligation to conform to the 1st amendment and if americans are deluded enough to think that they can say what they want without recriminations then they simply need to crawl back under what ever rock they crawled out of.
eToro is nothing else than a scam, they have peoples working to make new stupid rules with the only goal to make peoples loosing their money. Their platform fail everyday and they never bothered trying to fix it, getting better servers, hiring real programers etc… Their support is so bad and their employees don’t even know what they’re doing, all they do when you open a ticket to complain about some problem you’ve got is giving you a copy pasted common answer and so on,…
I’ve been with them for over 6months and there is so much to complain about.
Better go to http://truetoro.org to get a better idea of this scam.
Here is someone complaining as well http://forums.babypips.com/candlesticks-chart-patterns-price-action/61199-etoro-withdrawal-problem-stay-away-scam-broker.html
There is also a Facebook group with hundreds of members complaining about them and planing to sue them.
Stay away from this scam
There is nothing wrong with Etoro social trading concept however I believe that they really need to make it much better than what it is offering. Selection procedures, risk management and performance metrics all needs to be reviewed. I would rather prefer Zulutrade that is trying to implement such metrics and offers variety. Still, social platforms are in their early days and we all will continue to scrutinize them until they reach a certain level where we are somewhat satisfied. Currensee is another good platform with different model where traders are pre-screened to offer much better results. Nevertheless, their current portfolio of trade leaders is limited and there is no proof to suggest that overall performance is better than Zulu and vice versa. Apart from these three, Collective 2 has some really good leaders trading alternate instruments but I am not sure how effective is their business model. Overall, I would like to see all these social platforms initiating services something like the new entrant ‘trade slide’, which will also face our scrutiny once in the limelight.
but how do etoro make money when their customers lose money? That makes absolutely no sense at all. Etoro need their customers to be making money for them to make money.
The biggest problem on etoro is the fact that majority of people on there have no clue about trading, and just throw all of their money into coping others without doing any research or diversifying their capital. Then when unsuprisingly, they lose all their money they complain and get ****ty when they can’t get their money back
Thats right! Social trading sites are just providing us a platform to get benefit from others knowledge. It depends on us how we manage these platforms. Even now looking at Zulu, you can see that a large proportion of investors rely on strategies where regular small profits are made at the expense of huge drawdowns. Investors remain satisfied until that one big loss that can wipe out their accounts. As for some strategists, this strategy is working fine for more than a year (despite what Forex traders are told 2:1. 3:1 risk-reward). I think etoro, Zulu and others are still in early stages of social trading, which itself seems a revolution. Instead of blaming them, try looking at their performance tool to gauge the probability of success.
[QUOTE=“AussieLad;593636”]but how do etoro make money when their customers lose money? That makes absolutely no sense at all. Etoro need their customers to be making money for them to make money. The biggest problem on etoro is the fact that majority of people on there have no clue about trading, and just throw all of their money into coping others without doing any research or diversifying their capital. Then when unsuprisingly, they lose all their money they complain and get ****ty when they can’t get their money back[/QUOTE]
You are partly wrong… Etoro is a marked maker, that means that when you buy, they sell, and the other way around… So they actually earn money when you loose…
You are right about people not diversifying their investments, but even the ones that do that loose money due to the flaws in the copy system, and the laggy webtrader… Theese problems have been there for over 1.5 years, etoro knows about them, have aknoleged that the problems exists, but havent fixed them…so for the people praising etoro, try and do some research before you praise them 
Have you traded (had a live account across) all these platforms? Care to share with us your experience… I am more interested in the zulutrade one…
Personally, I never had an investor account with Zulu. As part of a research project, I evaluated their Trader Program to generate signals. Without doubting the credibility of other social trading systems, I firmly believe that Zulu offers more depth and greater transparency over most of its rivals. I mean, I am impressed by the innovative performance measuring tools they offer. For instance, the drawdown factor that represents the total loss of open trades at any given time rather than the usual percentage drawdown measure used by the industry is certainly innovative. The later (the industry standard, drawdown) is not a true representation of performance as percentage drawdown portrays different results for shorter and longer time-frames). This is just one example why I like Zulus innovation.
Comparing Zulu with similar platforms yields another positive characteristic of Zulu, which is the number of established traders to follow. For instance, i could find (may be 13, don’t remember) traders with 2 years and more history and less than 25% drawdown. Of course, there is more you may select depending on the risk.
Also, I found that traders are not using Zulu as they should be. There is a lot more potential in it. I and other researchers were surprised by the ‘Amateur like’ approach of investors in selecting the right trader to follow. Actually, this also has to do with the ranking algorithm of Zulu that yields to marketing tactics (my opinion).
Anyway, for traders following Zulu they should diversify their portfolio as much as possible. If I were the investor, I will pick at least 8 reputable providers and use Zulu automatic trade settings to allot equal risk. In selecting those traders, i will also assume that 1 out of every 5 well-established traders will somehow lose significantly in one quarter (replacing them with a new provider). Even, then I think the investor will be very much in a positive territory.
Also look at trade slide. There is another new one launching within months (I cant remember the name but I will post it once i remember). Probably, these and other platforms will change the industry as we see it. Thanks
Well, my opinion… in terms of platform, you might want to look else where other than etoro.
Yes zulutrade is the better option in my opinion, have been researching it as well.
Have been asking them how they calculate certain statistics like previously mentioned about the drawdown.
Its really good.
Having said that you gotta ask yourself what are your goals.
If you are expecting 100% per month or 1000s of % per annum then forex is not for you.
Many people hope to put in small amounts and expect to get a 100 fold return in a short time.
Those traders you see on Zulutrade that has 1000s of % ROI are all short history traders. Yet I see they have millions of following $s. I immediately know that the followers are newbie followers.
I would rather choose a guy with 10-30% ROI per year with 3-5 years of record.
Its a more sound investment choice, then with someone who has a 1000% ROI but only 5 months of history.
I am sorry to say that, but without any trading account with the platform, how can you objectively evaluate it? Did you at least test on demo?
I dont agree that all the Zulutrade trades diversify pair too much, the strategies are so so many, that cant be generated that. Some make a mix, others, actually try to use up to three pairs, the sample is quite big to draw any conclusion. In general what I do is trying to hedge with the traders themselves - meaning with the positions they open. This is a good way to optimize performance and minimize the risk.
Thanks for clarifying. I must admit that I used a demo account and live signal provider account with Zulu. As the purpose of my research and the post in question) was to evaluate traits of signal provider, I did not find it worth mentioning that I used demo (follow trade signals) for 4 days.
Actually, I find it appealing that new traders and even those who are not on a demo can objectively evaluate their chances by looking at trade metrics provided by Zulu (which I mentioned is a positive feature of Zulu). For instance, anyone can get an idea of slippage by looking at the slippage chart of a provider and compare it to their broker. Also, trade performance of each follower is compared with the signal provider offering some idea on what traders can expect in live accounts (provided that the follower doesn’t change order metrics etc). From a new user perspective, Zulu offers possibly the greatest variety of tools to evaluate traders before going live and may I dare to suggest (even before opening demo account). Otherwise, I must admit that you’r right in stating that it is difficult to evaluate anything before trying a demo or a real account.
One thing that Zulutrade lack is the amount the trader has.
For example look at WallStreet Forex Robot EUR33+GBP30 REAL System | Myfxbook
This guy has an account with $2k plus. He has a good record.
But I saw another guy with $300k in his account and going relatively well.
I asked zulutrade why they don’t have this. They say its confidential.
I still think it is a vital information.
Why?
Because a trader managing an account with $2k VS $300k will have a different perspective.
You will trade differently with more money. So it IS a very vital factor.
Imagine you put 10k to follow someone and he only is “playing” with $100.
Wil you want a “fund manager” to manage your 10k when he only has $100 of his own money at stake?
This is becoming a Zulu thread instead of eToro. lol. Yes, the suggestion is very logical.
Zulu has a green icon representing traders with real accounts (can be filtered in advanced search). Looking at lot size of the trades in real account may offer us a clue of trader’s capital.
However, I still feel that it is a part of marketing strategy where Zulu don’t want to discourage potential signal providers. Personally, it will be a huge drawback for me if I want to become a signal provider but don’t have a large equity to start with OR if I have to open a real account. Overall, it may be one of the reasons that operational model of Zulu is so successful.
I really dont think how much money the signal provider has at stake should be a problem. All an investor has to care about is the returns he or she can make. If the signal trader is using a demo account but bringing in good returns to his followers they should be pleased. They followed him for the returns not how much he is making on his own money. But then again he having his own money at stake will in a sense serve as a security against bad trading behavior.
I believe Zulu does have systems in place to limit exposure to such occurrences.
No zulutrade has tons , tons of system, I think more than myfxbook, or tradency. And yes I agree with all the points put above, but we all know, that live provider experience, is different, that from a follower.
Anyhow, anybody with etoro live account, follower’s by any chance?
I have to disagree. Knowing how much money someone has at risk is important to know, as it has a major effect on their trading mentality. The more money you have available, the more you can afford on losing trades before finding the trade that hits the jackpot. It also can dictate how diverified a trading strategy the investor has, especially if they are to follow the 1% trading capital that majority of traders on here recommend.
Whilst I can understand people not wanting their exact finances being made public, I think maybe grouping investors into rough bands ie 100-1000, 1001-5000, 5001-10000 would be a simple solution that appeases both parties. It protects peoples financial position whilst also allowing others to gain an idea of how much of their own capital said ‘guru’ is risking
I dont think the above should be attributed to etoro. Doubtful we can sum up in brackets all these trading results. If there will be any. I had an account with them lately, and it busted by the end of the trading week, unfortunately followers, in my opinion, there can simply not win.
Yes you make a lot of sense. And I agree with your opinions.
Another thing to note is that MANY if not MOST OF THEM have a very high NME, Necessary minimum equity.
This means if they open 0.1 mini lot which is 1 micro lot and you need $100s - $1000s just to follow them then something is wrong.
So actually there are lots of traders there that seem to be making money. But upon digging further, if you just blindly copy them you will bust your account, that is why even copying gurus is not that easy and for the faint heart.
But you make a lot of sense.
As for people who think the amount is not important, they don’t understand psychological effects of trading.
If you don’t think the amount is important, answer me this, will you want to put your money with me if I am managing my account with a $100 bank roll and you are investing 10k?? Would you want me to run your funds??
To me my mentality is I can afford to be risky. Because honestly if you give me $100 I can risk it on NFP for example, I can go all in. If I lose I lose all. If I win I double my money. THe most I lose $100 only. I would be willing to be risky.
Do you want to follow me with $10k?
As appose to if I have 100k, you will trust that I am serious.
My opinion is still it is important to know the amount of money he is managing for his own account.
I rather the problem of him having a bigger account and have the mentality of a huge buffer than someone with low funds and he feels he can risk more since its not a big account afterall.
If I have $100 and I follow someone with $10,000. He may feel comfortable with losing $3k which is only $30 from my account as long as in the long run he makes back. Because I know he is at least more serious than someone who deposits $100.
But if its the other way, if I have $10,000 and I follow someone who has $100, to him risking 100% which is $100 is still small risk, because end of the day he losses $100 only! And he can open another zulutrade account and deposit another $100 and try his luck, once he happen to be lucky for a few times in a row getting good winning rates, ppl start following him and he earns the commission.
But for me, everytime he losses $100 im out $10k, and I go bust.
Many of them have multiple accounts if you notice, some have different accounts for different strategies.
You can have 10 accounts per email address FYI, you can ask them.
So still, no thanks for me following someone with small funds.
His mind set is different no matter what, compared to someone with 10 times the amount he has.
BUT I think your 2nd point which is the idea of having a band range is also better than nothing.
So good suggestion there.
if you guys want to talk about Zulutrade then open an other thread, here it’s for [B]eToro[/B].