It’s not only “Britain” who want OUT ! - There is a growing and strong movement in Ireland (Eire) who are wanting with very good reason to overthrow the chains they are bound with - As a country who has tried to dominate the Irish for many centuries
UP the IRISH !
An interesting take on the Irish Border issue !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5V0x1fvK5o
It’s interesting how the “Leavers” in Ireland are way under-reported !
It appears that Sir Charles Duffy was not convicted and transported to Australia and did not become Australian Prime Minister…
It seems it’s not only Eire ;
Nexit ! Netherlands new force !
only a week old ? Perhaps I need to change the title of the thread ?
It’s interesting to note the different political system in Ireland and the UK and effect of same.
In UK it’s first past the post and never any cooperation between parties, even now when a little talking would have cleared up the current mess - it’s taking a long time because this talking thing is new territory.
In Ireland it’s PR which often produces coalitions between parties for the system of govt to work.
Parties are used to talking and compromise, last parliament produced a coalition of FineGael (right) and Labour (left) - this time the main opposition agree to abstain on matters of confidence thus allowing a minority govt to reign this past 3 years.
If I remember correctly UKIP would have a large representation in Westminster under PR.
Do you still have only the two parties - or do the “Little people” get a say too ?
That’s true - to an extent @peterma. The MEP Elections are PR and UKIP WON THOSE in 2014.
They cannot achieve many seats on a first past the post system and have no current MPs despite having polled 4 million votes last time.
The argument against PR has always been that it produces divided Govts and nothing ever gets done. The problem as I see it with this system is that only those with a pro or an anti for the two main (Currently) parties need bother to vote - everyone else is completely disenfranchised.
Well as one of the 17.4 million who have been disenfranchised by the cynical treatment we are getting from this “non-Government” of Remainers, I have to say I am ready to see a change.
It’s an interesting thought - effectively 10 mp’s are holding up the entire democratic process. The ERG have consistently affirmed that if the DUP agree then they agree, even today IDS and Owen Patterson accompanied them to Brussels.
First past the post has produced such a strange scenario, those 10 guys have to be by-passed and the only way to do it is by some sort of meeting of minds by the two main parties.
Btw - most UK people don’t realize how much they pay to keep NI, you’d be surprised - and from a business pov the question I’d ask - is the return worth it?
I swear I just had a conversation about this the other day. The media will only showcase and portray what they want you to hear and see. Media companies in general throughout the world especially the conglomerates (viacom, time warner, british sky, and etc) want you to be focused on the small stuff so they can bend us over backwards with no condoms. I swear I didn’t truly understand Brexit in its severity until I started watching youtube videos and actual listening to the locals. The thing is that these political elites readily try to push Brexit in the beginning like it was some easy task and it wouldn’t cause any faults. They basically were trying to sell you a pipe dream and the time you’d realize it’d be too late. The fact after all this time they still couldn’t come to a consensus is mind boggling to say the least. You’re messing with peoples lives and livelihood just for some political flex. These politicians are truly not in favor of the people and they are just trying to sell hogwash for their own political gain. It’s disgusting more importantly it’s just hurting the economy and putting a financial strain with all this uncertainty. Who knew we’d still be in 2019 and still be talking about Brexit - wtf…
That wasn’t actually what I meant @peterma, I have been mentally calling for the DUP to hold their position !
No on the contrary - that disgraceful surrender that May has “agreed” is why I feel disenfranchised.
52% voted "Leave"
47% voted "Remain
clear 10% majority for “Leave”
May ( a committed remainer) has surrendered our country’s future to an ideal she has agreed with the 75% of the House of commons who are Remainers !
ALL of the Token “Exiters” she has had in the Cabinet have Resigned in Protest and anguish - There isn’t much else they can do to express their sheer disgust.
I am now looking forward to “pulling her pants down” and spanking her most royally at the MEP Elections - Just like Barnier and Tusk have been doing for the last 2 years !
She will of course try everything she can to prevent those elections and the opportunity it will provide for us to show that anti - EU feeling has hardened a lot and she is head to head defying the British Population !
Uncertainty is no problem - it’ll all come out in the wash - my parents lived with far more uncertainty ! - My Dad not knowing whether he would be shot or shelled tomorrow and my mum not knowing whethre the bombs would hit their house tomorrow !
I didn’t know until a couple of days ago that Heath knew perfecly well when he took us in to the “Common Market” that it was a project designed to give away our country ! The documents proving that are still available and have been shown in one of my links.
So it’s not only May and the current Parliament who has betrayed us - but Heath was Conservative too ! - It seems only Maggie saw through the scam.
I think, from the thrust of your post @momoisnyc that you are looking at the wrong You tube vids - try some of the ones I have linked to on this thread and also on the "Why would you stay on a sinking ship " thread ! 
Love it ! - But it’s the House of Commons, House of Lords and the EU who think we’re dumb enough to fall for Project Fear !
The EU are now openly admitting that which they have denied for years - I speak of the EU ARMY !
TRY THIS ONE !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CY_BgnZdwko
Now that we have active “EXIT” elements in Spain, Italy, Greece, Eire and I believe France, as well as in the UK and of course our other Flag Bearer - the Netherlands - whose EU sceptic Party - only formed 2 years ago - is now the Dominant Party having WON the Elections a week or so ago.
There are those who are saying that the “EU Army” haste is nothing to do with “Defence against external force” - but everything to do with compelling by force abject obedience of the populations of it’s “Member - nations”
Aye, quite a lot of people on both sides hate the WA.
The DUP say they like it ok except for the backstop because the original format did not apply to GB so therefore treating NI differently which is unacceptable - thus the backstop was amended to cover all of UK…
Having said that they accept different treatment for NI on import/export of animals (since BSE crisis) so all are inspected at NI port of Larne, they also insist on NI being different on gay rights and are currently seeking a lower tax regime for NI business.
I’m not sure why remainers dislike the agreement, maybe because it sets the train of leave in motion, the implementation (expiry at end of next year) period can only be extended if BOTH UK and EU agree and I’m not sure why leavers dislike it (except re backstop).
There is no mention of the amount of ‘divorce bill’ although generally thought around 39bn - almost half of which covers the above impl period (or would have had it started March 29).
After the impl period all red lines are intact (no ECJ, no free movement of people, capital etc, no EU directives, everything UK decided) so for leavers it a short period when taken into the context of how long UK has been in EU
There is some points unfinished in the agreement - fishing is one, but most things are covered - even British Army bases, it’s a big read 
I think that is pretty clear - The treaty would pretty much lock us in to all the aspects we don’t like (and which the remainers Do, as you imply ) - BUT it does not offer the security of someone else making all our decisions for us and therefore us having “Someone to blame” - What it does do is give us some responsibility for making our own decisions - something which it seems a LOT of our politicians are frightened of ! 
She implied today that in her incestuous talks with Jeremy Corbyn, - even the “Customs Union” is back on the table !
Its just going to be a terrible fudge. Not really leave, not really remain. Nobody will really love it but their respective parties won’t be split into warring factions over it.
After a year or two, with the shock over and different leaders in charge and after another General election, it’ll be back to business as usual in Westminster.
Actually the opposite - the ECJ is out, UK courts decide on law, free movement - out, free riding the benefits - cannot happen.
Tax regime - UK only may decide, no input from EU - bottom line is that UK is not a member of the EU after the imp period.
This is where the remainers in labour have the problem - now it will be the UK to decide on rights etc,. what happens if there is not a leftist govt in charge is their worry.
Then the question springs to mind - will there be a leftist govt in the UK, think back pre Momentum, pre Blair, back to Militant Tendency.
One thing about being British ( and Irish) - the dislike of extremes.
Lol, just read the adjective re the relationship between Corbyn and May - brilliant.
Now watching ‘still open all hours’ bbc1 - there is a EU aspect to tonight’s episode, complete enjoyment for oldies like me
May Elections are causing them some concern - Do we think the Euro is a “Short” ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vYFGz6tEvs
I link to this video since he has apparently been demonetised - to silence free speech !
Another view of the assault on free speech in Ireland - I had no idea about this "Ireland 2040 " dictat - but it seems to be not just in the UK that we are now frigtened to say what we think !
11 minutes well spent listening to this
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