Political Opinion

[Master_Tang]

face palm

So Jesus was a historical figure. Using the same criteria as posted above, one could make the case that Mohammad, Bhudda, or even someone like Martin Luther King are no less important.

The fact that Christianity has deified him is irrelevant. Muslims have deified Mohammed, and Bhuddists have deified Bhudda the same way.

As for divinity, and a book, using the same theory as the Bible code Moby **** has predicted the future. Assassinations Foretold in Moby ****

The bottom line is, believe what you want. BUT, bringing god into things has usually resulted in more deaths than the random shooting situations. The Crusades ring a bell? How about the Inquisition? And incidents like Salem… Not to mention the spate of Islamic terror we have been experiencing the last 25 years or so. Jihad is based on the words of a prophet too. And those people are a LOT more pious than we are. Prayer every day, every person in the city.

Don’t tell me that because they are Islamic, the morality that Christianity’s god brings would be better. Humanity was extremely violent long before there was prayer in the schools, and bringing prayer back won’t change anything.

Now, tell me that there was some serious research into the use of psych drugs and people that are prone to snap, and I would pay rapt attention.

[paw3000]

When they verified the bible against the scrolls it was highly accurate (95%).

[B]95%[/B], You should know that writing this accuracy percentages in a forex forum is a[B] forbidden[/B] and [B]punishable[/B] act!

I think someone should always approach foreign ideas and concepts with empathy. You don’t have to agree but at least understand. I don’t agree with socialism but I understand it. I understand how it’s a good idea and that for the most part people who want it want fairness and equality no discourse. But it doesn’t work because the leaders abuse their power. The same thing happens with capitalism. I also understand human nature. I understand that we are lazy. I understand that the only time we put forth effort is if the reward for the effort is worth it to us.

ok, now seriously, i cant agree more with this post.

I think someone should always approach foreign ideas and concepts with empathy. You don’t have to agree but at least understand.

how different would be this world if everyone thought this way…

I understand that the only time we put forth effort is if the reward for the effort is worth it to us.

Now i ask you, Can be this reward something diferent than pleasure?
if the answer is “no”, we are not different from animals in this aspect…
can be this the animal behaviour that banker928 was asking for, in order to prove Darwin theory, a few posts ago?
just adding a little more food for thought

[Shatners_Last_Stand]

Ok, now for the REALLY deep question… Who or what the heck is picking the advertisements that show in the header on this post? I clicked to this page and the advertisement read, “test your knowledge of the bible”. Now it changed to something forex related. You want it you got it…Toyota

[TyrannosaurusForex]

I know there was a gun discussion in this thread somewhere. I’ve never seen pro-gun arguments presented better, in more detail, and by a highly credentialed author than in the article that I’m linking to. It is a long read, but no matter which side of this debate you are on, you will probably learn something by reading this.

Larry Correia refutes the gun controllers once and for all — 1389 Blog - Counterjihad!

[TyrannosaurusForex]

Ok, now for the REALLY deep question… Who or what the heck is picking the advertisements that show in the header on this post? I clicked to this page and the advertisement read, “test your knowledge of the bible”. Now it changed to something forex related. You want it you got it…Toyota

I’ve had ads show up based on recent Google searches I’ve done. For example, at Christmas I was looking for slippers on Google and magically, ads for slippers started showing up here on BabyPips.

[paw3000]

Master Tang…

Okay first off what is the date today? Hmmm it seems the calender is entirely based on Jesus.

You say don’t quote the bible and discount the dead sea scrolls. Well this post would be about as thick as a bible if I were to try and show you every bit of evidence so I will stick to some basic stuff.

I’m not trying to convert you or anyone just a little food for thought…

The book of Daniel was written 556 bc It is a book that is well known for it’s prophecy. I will expand upon just one (as it relates to the dead sea scrolls)

In the book of Daniel the author prophesies about Alexander the Great and his rule. He also prophesies about ATJ leaving his wife for another and his wife killing her. Also prophesies about his general eventually taking over as ruler.

I won’t bother going into a deep theological discussion other than to say that there is solid evidence that this is exactly what was prophesied and there are certain “rules” that back this up. If you want to look into it I encourage you to do that so you can understand more clearly.

These prophesies were so exact and so perfect that most historians thought it was a fraud. After all how can so many details be exact about a man’s rule in 356 bc and who would eventually die in 323 bc?

The historians believed that The Book of Daniel had to be written after Alexander the Great. There was no other explanation.

–than–

on the west bank in palestine in 1947 (ish) the dead sea scrolls were discovered and since it has been proven that in fact The Book of Daniel was written before Alexander the Great thus proving it a true prophecy.

On that note there are in fact 2500 prophecies in the bible in which 2000 have been fulfilled.
Just the prophecies about Jesus alone number about 300. Some of these were written thousands of years before Jesus was born.

side note If you doubt Jesus was born I can prove that beyond a shadow of a doubt. The real question should be was Jesus God? (or God’s son depending who you ask) but again I am trying to keep this post smaller than War and Peace so…

Okay so lets talk probabilities. A study conducted at MIT talking about Jesus just fulfilling 8 prophecies. I’m talking about things He could not have any possible control over (earthly control) for example where He was born, when He was born, manner of Death: People’s reactions, piercing of side, burial Resurrection ets.

The odds of just 8 prophecies being fulfilled are 1 in 100 trillion!
Think about that number for a second…

Somebody in an earlier post referenced Texas so here you go

1 in 100 trillion odds are like

If I were to take 100 trillion silver dollars and lay them on the face of Texas, they would be two feet deep. Now if I marked one of these silver dollars and thoroughly stir the whole mass–all over the state. Now blindfold a man and let him travel as far as he wishes, but he must pick only one silver dollar.

What would the chances of him picking the marked silver dollar? That is the same odds of Jesus fulfilling only 8 prophecies by coincidence!

If you look at this evidence with wisdom you have no choice but to conclude that
A. The bible is supernatural in nature
B. Jesus fulfilling those prophecies was no coincidence

As for the question did Jesus really exist. The answer is a resounding Yes! In fact even His enemies proved his existence. There is strong and undeniable proof.

As for is Jesus really God if you really want me to post my answer I will be happy to but grab a coffee and relax because it is going to be a long long post.

Thanks,
John

BTW I truly hope I haven’t offended anyone

I think this posts are truly interesting, not offending at all!
but there is a gap in your argumentations, which has been already pointed out by Master Tang.
you prove the existance of Jesus, basically with testimonials. but the fact is that without the bible the details about jesus life would be unknown. The guy existed, yes, no doubts, but all the concrete thinks we know about him are based on the bible. So Again we must trust the bible. Who tell us all prophesies has fulfilled? the bible.
We are at the same point we started; proving the existance of jesus as a man, doesnt means that what the bible says about him must be true.

I think there is only one truth about this, the existance of god can’t be proved and cant be refuted.

The eternal discussion between religious and atheists is useless; nobody will persuade the other, we should stay together against fanatism.
So let people do what they want or what they feel about them believes, respect personal freedom, and this will be a better world to live in. So much better than a world ruled only by christianism or only by atheism.

just my thoughts

PS:

Ok, now for the REALLY deep question… Who or what the heck is picking the advertisements that show in the header on this post? I clicked to this page and the advertisement read, “test your knowledge of the bible”. Now it changed to something forex related. You want it you got it…Toyota

that deep question killed me :o

[Shatners_Last_Stand]

@paw3000

PS: that deep question killed me :o

Ha! Got a picture of it this time. You’ve got to admit this is funny! Welcome to babypips.com. The beginners guide to forex trading…and while you’re there…test your bible knowledge and download the app. :33:

[wigglez]

The hate they stand for is based on their interpretation of scripture. They have cherry picked passages to back up their skewed beliefs.

They bastardized it.

And yes, they are lawyers. They sue over everything.

Nah, I meant they don’t actually believe in what they’re doing. They’re just looking to get paid. The man has a history of being a jerk.

[wigglez]

If Mary were labeled a ‘wh**e’, she would have been stoned to death correct?

If so, then is it not possible she made up the lie of virgin birth and son of god to save herself? If she did that, then there is no doubt Jesus would have delusions of grandeur, and would have been the biggest lie in history.

[IyaJenkei]

If Mary were labeled a ‘wh**e’, she would have been stoned to death correct?

If so, then is it not possible she made up the lie of virgin birth and son of god to save herself? If she did that, then there is no doubt Jesus would have delusions of grandeur, and would have been the biggest lie in history.

I’m sure they checked her hymen lol

[wigglez]

I’m sure they checked her hymen lol

Exposing my ignorance of female body. How would one check that?

[IyaJenkei]

Exposing my ignorance of female body. How would one check that?

That was a joke mostly lol. It isn’t to far up there. the Jews knew about it. The fathers gave their daughters away. The day after the consummation they kept the sheets as a trophy lol. To make sure everyone knew their daughter had waited until marriage.

[wigglez]

That was a joke mostly lol. It isn’t to far up there. the Jews knew about it. The fathers gave their daughters away. The day after the consummation they kept the sheets as a trophy lol. To make sure everyone knew their daughter had waited until marriage.

Wow, thats gross.

Wouldn’t the baby, you know, wreck it on his way out?

Well this was an awkward direction I took this thread, sheesh

[wigglez]

I know there was a gun discussion in this thread somewhere. I’ve never seen pro-gun arguments presented better, in more detail, and by a highly credentialed author than in the article that I’m linking to. It is a long read, but no matter which side of this debate you are on, you will probably learn something by reading this.

Larry Correia refutes the gun controllers once and for all — 1389 Blog - Counterjihad!

Thanks for that good read.

It’s quite long Cyco, but I think you should read it. Not skim it, but actually read it, and then I’d like to hear your opinion on it.

[Cyco]

Is there any historical proof that Jesus existed?

So the whole historical record of a guy who cured the lame, turned water into wine, upturned the money lenders table at the temple, and rose from the dead is 2 independent sources that mention a cult where they worship a guy called Christ?

Nothing from anyone alive at the time, nothing from anyone in the area? They didn’t think he worth writing about?

Hugely convincing.

It’s always funny how atheists are the first to quote the Bible and often consider themselves experts on it, yet they completely misunderstand Christianity. Christianity is not the Bible. The Bible is only the word of God. How can you possibly expect to understand the word of God if you have no relationship with Him? No wonder you read it so out of context, you read it with a mindset of “let’s prove this thing wrong wherever possible”. I have been a Christian for almost 2 decades and yet I don’t throw scriptures around the way atheists like to.

I grew up as a christian, went to Sunday school, church, all that. Then realised it was a lot of mind control crap. Is that enough of a relationship?

I don’t read it out of context, I have read it many times cover to cover. It doesn’t need context - as you say it is the word of god. Pointing out some of the insane passages is easy to do (there are plenty of them) and so people tend to do it to make their point. Should I not do that? Does it make you uncomfortable to know your loving god supports murder, rape, and kidnapping?

God being “surprised by Adam’s sin” - I almost fell out of my chair at that one! LOL

Either god was/is omnipotent and omnipresent and so knew by putting the forbidden fruit in the garden it would get eaten and he would then kick them out of the garden (makes him seem like a bit of a prick), or is not all powerful and all knowing because he was surprised by it.

Which is it?

[Cyco]

I know there was a gun discussion in this thread somewhere. I’ve never seen pro-gun arguments presented better, in more detail, and by a highly credentialed author than in the article that I’m linking to. It is a long read, but no matter which side of this debate you are on, you will probably learn something by reading this.

Larry Correia refutes the gun controllers once and for all — 1389 Blog - Counterjihad!

I believe the biggest issues here are mental health and the media glorification

The 1st is a tough issue to solve, but it must be solvable for there are high firearm ownership rates in many parts of the world without lots of nutters going on shooting rampages there.

The 2nd is easier to do, but hard to measure the effectiveness of. Have a voluntary agreement that news stations do not mention the name of the shooter, nor display a photo, nor make graphic representations of the ‘current’ incident against previous ones. This will reduce the celebrity aspect of the crime, and also any chance the perpetrator will be able to show he is tough.

[Cyco]

To make it even more awkward/illuminating/multicultural…

In parts of the world where a virgin bride is still considered a necessity there is hymen re-constructive surgery for those that have had sex before the wedding night.

[johnnykanoo]

today (tomorrow in my timezone) is the day people used to celebrate the fact that days start to be longer, 15 days after the Winter Solstice. The 6 january and 25 december were celebrated by the Roman empire, egyptians and greeks, centuries before Christ.
The calendar you know (365 days and 52 weeks), was also implemented the year 46 bc… so its a big mistake to think the calendar is based on Jesus, because it was created before him; is exactly the other way, christianism celebrations are based on astronomic events and other cultures celebration days.

so this point is completely against your theory.

I meant the year. The year is 2013

B.C= before Christ and A.D. = Anno Domini (Latin for in the year of our Lord)

** My question to you is before Jesus was born dd they call the year B.C.
I’ll answer, of course not.

[johnnykanoo]

face palm

So Jesus was a historical figure. Using the same criteria as posted above, one could make the case that Mohammad, Bhudda, or even someone like Martin Luther King are no less important.

The fact that Christianity has deified him is irrelevant. Muslims have deified Mohammed, and Bhuddists have deified Bhudda the same way.

As for divinity, and a book, using the same theory as the Bible code Moby **** has predicted the future. Assassinations Foretold in Moby ****

The bottom line is, believe what you want. BUT, bringing god into things has usually resulted in more deaths than the random shooting situations. The Crusades ring a bell? How about the Inquisition? And incidents like Salem… Not to mention the spate of Islamic terror we have been experiencing the last 25 years or so. Jihad is based on the words of a prophet too. And those people are a LOT more pious than we are. Prayer every day, every person in the city.

Don’t tell me that because they are Islamic, the morality that Christianity’s god brings would be better. Humanity was extremely violent long before there was prayer in the schools, and bringing prayer back won’t change anything.

Now, tell me that there was some serious research into the use of psych drugs and people that are prone to snap, and I would pay rapt attention.

I do respect your opinion and I am willing to agree to disagree Everyone does have there own opinions and your right some people did terrible things in the name of God and in the name of Christianity. I will not talk about any one religion in those terms accept to agree with you.

Was Jesus “defined” in the bible? I suppose so but you can’t deny the prophecies that came true. I suppose you would have to say its some sort of fantastic coincidence.

As for Moby **** idk? I looked at your link and it looked like a crossword puzzle. The bible prophecies are written normally. They are not hidden, well not “coded” and honestly even if you were an atheist, if you spent time studying them you would be impressed. I’m sure of it.

As far as bringing prayer back. I don’t agree with that either. Every “man” makes there own decisions for themselves and there Children.

What I find ridiculous is taking Christ out of Christmas, forcing people to take down there nativity scenes. Not allowing any aspect of Christianity present in school at all on any level, I think is a little crazy. When my son was in first grade (not to long ago) they had this thing called “cast a spell” and it was a spelling game where kids come up and write on the wall. To me, that is occult teaching, even if jokingly, or a play on words. Nevertheless my point is Christians are targeted and for some reason persecuted for our beliefs. Our country was founded on Christian beliefs (mostly) and the works of great men such as Thomas Jefferson have been perverted.

As for the use of psych drugs who knows? The fact is life is unpredictable and the day of our death is unknown to us. We can eat healthy, live smart, where our seat belts, do all those things and still get killed because it is completely out of our hands.

Pretty soon our money will say “In America we Trust!”

[johnnykanoo]

I think this posts are truly interesting, not offending at all!
but there is a gap in your argumentations, which has been already pointed out by Master Tang.
you prove the existance of Jesus, basically with testimonials. but the fact is that without the bible the details about jesus life would be unknown. The guy existed, yes, no doubts, but all the concrete thinks we know about him are based on the bible. So Again we must trust the bible. Who tell us all prophesies has fulfilled? the bible.
We are at the same point we started; proving the existance of jesus as a man, doesnt means that what the bible says about him must be true.

I think there is only one truth about this, the existance of god can’t be proved and cant be refuted.

The eternal discussion between religious and atheists is useless; nobody will persuade the other, we should stay together against fanatism.
So let people do what they want or what they feel about them believes, respect personal freedom, and this will be a better world to live in. So much better than a world ruled only by christianism or only by atheism.

just my thoughts

I agree the prophecies are all contained in the bible yes. However there fulfillment is a matter of record in different documents and by different historians including people who hated Christians. The eye whitness testimony found in the four gospels would hold up in court today.

Think about there testimony, even faced with torture and painful death they stood by there story. Who you stand by a lie when getting dipped into boiling oil? Think about it?

There is even evidence of Jesus" resurrection outside the bible. However it is up to you to believe what you want. For me there is far to much proof to deny and I am a critical thinker and I seek facts.

unrelated
as far as Darwinism, one question, why do we still have monkeys? enough said. There is a fundamental flaw to his THEORY why did some evolve and not others?