Russia has invaded Ukraine

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Oh do learn to read between the lines !

"The Wild, Wild East - YouTube

An account from CRP of his journey out of Kiev - BY RAIL !

Its funny, Mr Falstaff, you talk about discussing and yet I am not seeing any discussion from you at all - just a pile of dubious videos. The last video I did look at and it has been shown to be completely erroneous. So I really don’t think I am going to waste time trying to find out what you are trying to say by ploughing through a load of even more dubious claims by yet even more dubious authors.

Whilst I guess it is good that someone supports these people’s advertising income from their videos, if you have a point to discuss then I would really prefer, and appreciate, hearing it in your own words…otherwise I have no comment.

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So it seems that the second round of talks between Russian and Ukrainian teams is now underway. As anticipated, in the run up to these talks, Russia has increased its attacks on towns and infrastructure and more talk of nuclear warfare.

I guess it would be too simple for Ukraine just to give Russia a 5-year guarantee not to apply for NATO membership provided Russia accepted Ukraine as an independent state and does not attack it - to be reviewed again after 5 years.

Yes, too simple because Russia wants to control Ukraine and cannot recognise its independence and wants to completely demilitarise it, at least until it can remilitarise it itself.

So I guess we won’t see anything concrete from this session. It could be a promising step forward, though, if they could at least agree to a mutually-acceptable neutral external arbitrator to control and shepherd the process forward.

WHAT AM i TRYING TO SAY ?

I’m thinking. Why not just send in elite special forces, storm his palace and put a bullet in his head ? Send in the best of the best, the elitest, Or better and safer, do a drone strike on him from an undetectable stealth drone after making 100% sure it is him walking about outside ?

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I think that is what a lot of people are thinking. But even if something like that succeeded, it would not necessarily end the conflict, rather it would probably immediately escalate it to a global level and with even worse weaponry - and that is if it succeeded! What about if the mission failed! :thinking:

I think a lot of hopes are being placed on the possibility of generating internal pressures to depose Mr Putin via the economic sanctions which will rapidly start to disintegrate their economy in a serious way. The longer it continues the broader and deeper will be the economic cost to Russia.

In the meantime, Mr Putin restates his belief that the Ukrainians and Russians are one people and yet continues indiscriminate killing of civilians and creating suffering through the destruction of basic public infrastructure including, heating, power, water and sanitation. Even though one of the reasons offered for sending his “peacekeeping” force into Ukraine was to prevent apparent genocide in the eastern regions.

Although the negotiations did seem to achieve some localised ceasefires to allow humanitarian aid and, presumably, refugee movements, it is still a long way from resolving the war.

Mr Putin continues to stoke up the nuclear scaremongering, this time by shelling and setting on fire the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power station - which happens to be the largest nuclear power generating plant in Europe. The fires are now extinguished and apparently radiation levels are normal. So is this another example of Mr Putin showing the world what he can do, and presumably will do, if and whenever he wants to, if he doesn’t get his own way?

Once again, the western world is showing incredible restraint and admirable unification in its response - but I feel we are now sailing very close to the edge, too close…

It raises the question, is this really all just about Ukraine? Or is this just the start of the major shift in global power politics. A waning in US influence as it slowly implodes on internal political divisions and an ever-increasing debt burden verses an expanding Chinese economic power with the benefits of long-term dictatorship, a huge workforce and internal market, and an ever-expanding influence in other continents.

If China then holds hands with Russia and North Korea with a combined nuclear threat, where will the west then stand?

The world has very limited resources and nowhere near enough to support a high life-style across the globe. It kind of brings to mind the theme from H.G. Wells “War of the worlds”:

" … minds immeasurably superior to ours regarded this Earth with envious eyes, and slowly and surely, they drew their plans against us."

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er Evidence !

It is true that in 15 lengthy comments - you have produced zero evidence of anything - but without any evidence at all are prepared to discount my evidence as ;

And without even considering my latest Evidence (with references AND sources)

Some might say that just shows fear - or weakness AND might add that it is the western weakness which has precipitated this situation !

Quite so !

Where on earth are you getting THAT Particular “Opinion” from ??? - EVIDENCE Please !

There are two types of contributors to forums: those that discuss and share and those that just troll others - guess which category you fall into Mr Falstaff…oh, and if you want evidence of that just read you own stuff here…

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Once again - in line with many of your ilk - you refuse to answer any of the valid points raised and attempt to have “the last word” - by a purely Ad-Hominem attack !

You have raised nothing of your own to answer!!! - you only post surrogate opinions of others who have no credentials for their view in videos that you expect others to watch and try and understand what your view, if any, might be.

You say "read between the lines" yet you only publish one-liners so that is rather difficult!

I have no interest in what you continue to write here and I will continue to post my own views as I see it. If that offends you then don’t read it - this is FORUM for the exchange of ideas, not throwing tantrums just because others don’t agree with what you might think yourself - if we even knew what that was since you never do more than criticise others - I guess you are in the age group 70-75?

I have muted you as I have no interest in seeing your posts so spray you poison for others to see but I will not see them. Enjoy your day.

Well it would seem that this particular post-modernist “Wokester” can’t cope with the inconvenient injection of facts, evidence and truth !

In fact he / she is so disturbed that others might want to discuss the validity of his / her “Opinions” that he / she sticks his / her fingers in their ears so as to become deaf to dissent !

I wonder what particular parallels we can draw here with the current actions of the “media” - both “Social” and “Legacy” ?

[Those particular forms of weakness which the rest of the world is capitalising on as we speak ! ]

There is a report from the BBC on comments from the World Bank president, describing the war in Ukraine as a “Catastrophe” for global economic growth.

I guess that is not exactly anything much of a surprise since sanctions always work both ways. But he emphasises that this is particularly so now when the world is already rising out of the impact of Covid and struggling with rising inflation.

Increases in energy and food prices hit everyone and the war + sanctions is not going to help. He quotes examples of sunflower oil, of which Ukraine is apparently the world’s biggest producer and Russia number two - and between them they account for some 60% of global production.

These two countries also, according to JP Morgan, account for nearly 30% of global wheat exports.

Energy is a unique problem in Europe with its dependency on Russia, but that is already a well-documented issue.

The point is, from a trading point of view, where does that leave the prospects for indices, commodities and, indeed, currencies. The US indices have remained remarkably stable, albeit with wide ranges - so far.

Today is Non-Farm Payrolls, normally one of the most watched releases in the monthly calendar. Somehow it seems currently to be somewhere on the back shelf compared with other issues. But it is still an important factor in the total picture today - tomorrow may be different. That is the world we live in right now…

The Leader of the Western World explains “What is going on in Ukraine” - to her Followers !

:wink: :rofl: :rofl:

Fills you full of Confidence :slightly_smiling_face:

- Doesn’t it ?? :expressionless:

Stoltenberg commented after the meeting with NATO foreign ministers. He confirmed that we are witnessing terrible suffering in Ukraine, the likes of which we have not seen in Europe since the 2nd World War.

He also confirmed a very important point that the NATO partners are unanimous that they will not send troops into Ukraine due to the likelihood that to do so would escalate the existing war beyond Ukraine’s borders.

Meanwhile, other reports out of Russia claim that most Russians still believe from their domestic media that Russian forces are on a peacekeeping mission to free the Ukrainian people and that Ukrainian civilian victims are solely due to the Ukrainian forces using them as a human shield.

But like we said earlier, the first victim in war is always the truth. This is perhaps the first major war on this scale in Europe since the significant spread of social media and that brings with it many new aspects, some good, some bad.

It means it can bring the war vividly into everyone’s own living room with detailed videos and pictures and live news reports and commentaries. Unfortunately, it also opens the door to a lot of false disinformation and outright lies. For example, one video of a fighter plane overflying Kiev was apparently actually a clip from a computer game. Maybe it was, maybe it wasn’t. The fact is one has to filter everything that is heard or seen with care. And it is maybe generally wiser to lean on news repeated from several major reputable sources rather than just occasional isolated statements and opinions. They may be genuine or they may have an ulterior motive.

How long until China turns up the heat on Taiwan?

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Certainly, the current immediate European-based power battle is pushing other issues out of the headlines, but the China issues are still there.

China does not vote against Russia in, for example, UN security council meetings and no doubt the situation would be reciprocal in issues against China.

But I suspect that China has its own ambitions, objectives and timetables that are not necessarily directly linked to those of Russia right now. But that is not to say that they have gone away.

So some slightly better events, if one can call anything going on “better”.

A temporary ceasefire to allow civilians to leave two cities. Buses are arranged and own transport is allowed provided it does not deviate from the agreed official routes.

Good news? In a way, of course, but…

What can it be like to have to pack what you can into a few suitcases, deciding what to take and what to leave in what has been your home for years. You have no idea where you are going, and even less idea when you might return, and still less what you will find left of your life if and when you do return.

Your life becomes shrunken into a small microcosm of where you can sleep and where can you eat and what sanitary facilities exist. Your life and that of your family is entirely in the hands of humanitarian parties which direct you where to go and what to do.

Ok, so it is temporary, only until the situation settles down. But is it so temporary? Will there be housing, jobs, schools, even heating, food and water to go back to? How long does it take for a war-smashed country to revive, rebuild and re-economise? And what kind of country will it even be? Who will be the authorities?

So many uncertainties, so much to decide before any thought of return. It has taken just one week for over a million people to have their lives smashed. How long before they will be able to call their lives “normal”?

The cost is horrific in both human and economic terms. Surely, the overriding effort has to be containment and avoiding escalation even if it means further suffering at the heart of the inferno.

As any trained firefighter knows, the first concern is human life, the second concern is avoiding further spreading and thirdly extinguishing the flames. Beyond that lies determining the cause, assessing the damage, rebuilding, and avoiding the same repeating again.

At least we have now reached a first point of saving human lives through evacuation…

EDIT: I just read some reports that even this ceasefire is not being entirely observed and that there are attacks along the evacuation path - as is usual in these times, the truth of the matter probably lies somewhere in between varying, even opposing, claims.

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All that carnage, all that suffering, all those refugees all because of one mad man. He has chosen the toughest target to conquer on his list, which is Ukraine. He would have started with much smaller and easier targets like Moldova and Georgia, and I think they could be next on his list. And if he is insane enough to touch a NATO member country, it will be practically suicide for him.

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Indeed! This is always the terrible side of all wars, and the suffering never stops when the fighting ceases. It ruins people’s lives for ever. One would think there are other ways to “fight” in these modern times of digital services and information saturation.

Moldova would be difficult being on the other side of Ukraine, but the issue of who might be next, if anyone, is quite complex. Firstly, there is the question of whether Mr Putin is seriously only concerned about security threats from NATO/EU moving into Ukraine, or whether he is actually aiming to reinstate the old Russian grandeur, or even a new one! One could also ask the question, “why now”?

In either scenario there is a case to be made that the next chapter would be the Nordic countries who are not yet in NATO, i.e. Sweden and Finland. These have traditionally been neutral countries and have not presented a security threat to Russia, at least not since the end of WWII. But if these two countries were to now seek NATO membership following the attack on Ukraine then there will almost certainly be “words” said!

I agree that it would be a very dangerous move from his side, but the carnage will be absolutely horrendous all round. Almost certainly it would trigger the use of local tactical nuclear weapons, if not, ultimately strategic nuclear weaponry too.

I was thinking about NATO from Ukraine’s perspective. Their president is furious that NATO will not at least secure their airspace and NATO has (in my opinion) made the right decision not to. But if NATO did not exist, I cannot help wondering whether some European countries like the UK or France would have independently sent aircraft and/or troops into Ukraine. Whilst NATO is a big deterrent, it also limits the separate actions of its individual member nations.

Whatever may transpire, I think there is a good chance that you are right and that it will be necessary to change the title of this thread to include some other nations in the not so distant future. I sincerely hope not…

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For Finland and Sweden, these are highly developed countries with technologically advanced militaries, so I think they would be tougher adversaries than Ukraine, because the Russians are suffering heavy losses at the hands of the Ukrainians who have less advanced weapons.

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