I agree with whoever posted stop losses combined with the leverage. I personally do not use stops most of the time. Why? Because I am perfectly satisfied with losing 50% of my account in 1 trade if I mess up. I prefer manual stops. A stop loss makes you “visible” to your broker therefore increases your risk at getting stop hunted. Brokers do stop hunt, it is foolish to think they do not. All this conventional bull**** about stops rather annoys me. If you do not like to manually close out of your trades, maybe a stop loss is right for you, however, like I previously stated you are at an increased risk of being stop hunted… If not by your broker, by pro traders. Pro traders stop hunt as well. Do you know how easy it is to look at the market and have a very good guess at where most traders stops are? It’s ridiculously easy… most people put there stops at the same place. “Oh if the market passes this point obviously I am wrong so I should get out.” Guess what, just cuz the market hits any point no stop or not, it means nothing on future direction. I have personally seen the EUR/USD sell all day, and a pretty damn good sell all the sudden to reverse completely only to close Long for the day in literally the last 5 minutes of the day. 40-100 pips in one 5 minute candle is rare, but it happens all the time in one pair or another.
[QUOTE=“Leg0nd;616176”]I agree with whoever posted stop losses combined with the leverage. I personally do not use stops most of the time. Why? Because I am perfectly satisfied with losing 50% of my account in 1 trade if I mess up. I prefer manual stops. A stop loss makes you “visible” to your broker therefore increases your risk at getting stop hunted. Brokers do stop hunt, it is foolish to think they do not. All this conventional bull**** about stops rather annoys me. If you do not like to manually close out of your trades, maybe a stop loss is right for you, however, like I previously stated you are at an increased risk of being stop hunted… If not by your broker, by pro traders. Pro traders stop hunt as well. Do you know how easy it is to look at the market and have a very good guess at where most traders stops are? It’s ridiculously easy… most people put there stops at the same place. “Oh if the market passes this point obviously I am wrong so I should get out.” Guess what, just cuz the market hits any point no stop or not, it means nothing on future direction. I have personally seen the EUR/USD sell all day, and a pretty damn good sell all the sudden to reverse completely only to close Long for the day in literally the last 5 minutes of the day. 40-100 pips in one 5 minute candle is rare, but it happens all the time in one pair or another.[/QUOTE]
Very good point I’m kinda in the middle most times i use a stop if I’m not to sure about the trade , & others times i don’t use a stop & just close trade Manuly I have gotten stoped out soo many times with a stop & then then market ends up going the direction I though. But there are times when stops can be very important as well I know some one who lost a lot of money trading with out a stop loss infact I think they got there account wiped 450k account wiped in 1trade
[QUOTE=“Libertysilver;616285”]most times i use a stop if I’m not to sure about the trade[/QUOTE]
Personally I’d say that no one should ever be in a trade that they are not too sure about.
[QUOTE=“SimonTemplar;616356”] Personally I’d say that no one should ever be in a trade that they are not too sure about.[/QUOTE]
You can never be 100% sure on a trade I mean You can but you can also be 100% wrong to so what I mean by that is if I think a pairs going to a specific area and the markets not clear but theres a chance it could swing in that direction then I will use a tight stop limit if I’m wrong I’m wrong if I’m right I’m right I wouldn’t risk a whole lot on the trade either
[QUOTE=“Libertysilver;616364”] You can never be 100% sure on a trade I mean You can but you can also be 100% wrong to so what I mean by that is if I think a pairs going to a specific area and the markets not clear but theres a chance it could swing in that direction then I will use a tight stop limit if I’m wrong I’m wrong if I’m right I’m right I wouldn’t risk a whole lot on the trade either[/QUOTE]
Well obviously not, I’m not suggesting that someone should expect to be 100% sure of a trade’s outcome; but I do think that someone should be equally sure of the merits of any entry they take, rather than feeling more sure of one than another yet taking both. I’d only take a trade if I were 100% sure that it was a good setup, and then I’d approach each trade consistently, rather than varying my approach to each trade depending on relative, varying levels of confidence. Anyway, just my opinion.
[QUOTE=“SimonTemplar;616366”] Well obviously not, I’m not suggesting that someone should expect to be 100% sure of a trade’s outcome; but I do think that someone should be equally sure of the merits of any entry they take, rather than feeling more sure of one than another yet taking both. I’d only take a trade if I were 100% sure that it was a good setup, and then I’d approach each trade consistently, rather than varying my approach to each trade depending on relative, varying levels of confidence. Anyway, just my opinion.[/QUOTE]
Yeah make sense I agree totally but I was just sayying not all set up are perfectly clear , In that case I would use a tight stop and smaller position.
Tight stop? Unless you are scalping that sounds rather dumb to me. The tighter your stop, the easier it is for the Market Maker to take out that stop without having any reason to cover their tracks. Tight stops are the easiest ways to reduce your capital no matter how much risk you take. Small position or large position does not matter, the closer the stop, the higher statistical probability it will get taken out period.
As far as what the honorary member posted… I agree completely with this one. I follow a system, I don’t know about you guys. When you use a system to trade the market guess what? You are always 100% sure on the trade you place. By following a system there is no “guessing” that’s the whole point! There is no trade unless the system says there is, and if the system says there is a trade, boom, you enter. A system is not based on “feeling like its a good trade.”
[QUOTE=“Leg0nd;616379”] Tight stop? Unless you are scalping that sounds rather dumb to me. The tighter your stop, the easier it is for the Market Maker to take out that stop without having any reason to cover their tracks. Tight stops are the easiest ways to reduce your capital no matter how much risk you take. Small position or large position does not matter, the closer the stop, the higher statistical probability it will get taken out period. As far as what the honorary member posted… I agree completely with this one. I follow a system, I don’t know about you guys. When you use a system to trade the market guess what? You are always 100% sure on the trade you place. By following a system there is no “guessing” that’s the whole point! There is no trade unless the system says there is, and if the system says there is a trade, boom, you enter. A system is not based on “feeling like its a good trade.”[/QUOTE]
No matter what system you don’t have a crystal ball to see the outcome the market can do anything, anything can happen anything this is why we use risk managment , pro traders are only right 50% of the time , you can be sure 1000% on all your trades but dosent mean all your trades are going to be right & as for having tight stops if Know how to enter the market correctly you can have a tight stop and not have to worry about stop hunting or anything like that especially if you can pick tops and bottoms
I was just giving a example if I wasn’t sure of somthing I would take much less risk
If I wasn’t sure of a trade I Deff would not be looking to sit in it long term so it would be a scalp
Leg0nd,
Obviously you’re not trading with real money, at best maybe you’ve got some pocket change/ beer money at stake?
I hope any new and inexperienced traders reading your non-sense advice filters it through your very telling comment, [I][B]“I am perfectly satisfied with losing 50% of my account in 1 trade if I mess up.”[/B][/I]. :56:
Leg0nd posted a link to this video in a different thread, it is interesting and gives a pro’s perspective on SL’s.
[QUOTE=“Libertysilver;616389”]I was just giving a example if I wasn’t sure of somthing I would take much less risk[/QUOTE]
And that is precisely my point, that’s the bit I do differently, as in my view we shouldn’t be taking trades that we aren’t sure of. (Meaning sure of the quality of the setup, obviously the outcome is an unknown.) Anyway, we aren’t understanding one another so I’ll leave it there.
Thank you. You are one of my favorite honorary members at the moment xD. I have a professional view on stop losses I believe. Most trades I take I put a 100 pip sl as an oh **** i’m dead wrong and I didn’t get out manually in time. But you know what? I don’t know any broker than can spike the market 100 pips down to take me out of a trade I still could win in the specified time frame I am holding the trade for.
On to the other members saying I am trading “beer money” or “pocket change.” Yes you are correct to an extent. But you know what? If you can’t trade “pocket” change successfully, you can not trade ANY amount of money successfully. My goals in Forex are extremely different than yours my dude. I don’t have the time to lay out my plans for everyone nor do I care too. I have to go but I will be sure to add onto this post when I get back.
You look at my trades I have taken this past month and you tell me what I am doing despite my “unacceptable” risk management is not working. All of my successful trades have a pretty damn high “Risk to Reward Ratio.” My losing trades I have not lost that much money on despite my “unacceptable” risk level. The majority of these trades did not have a stop implemented. I only recently just added my 100 pip sl for the reasons posted above.
62% win rate for month, 71% win rate last week. How does your system compare? Of course winning rates do not mean anything. What matters is the $ amount in winning vs $ amount in losing trades. Obviously my winning trades are much higher than my losing trades otherwise my 110% return this month would not be possible.
Yes I’m trading high risk, enough of that already. I’m not conventional, If I was, I wouldn’t be trading anywhere near as successfully as I have been. Nor would I be making this much return off my “pocket” change as quickly. Remember that 98% fail and only the top 2% succeed in FX? Well I’m 100% positive that 2% does not follow or use the 98%'s conventional “wisdom” so to speak. In this market the cream of the crop rises to the top period. I want to hit the market as hard as possible and as quick as possible so I can get the **** out of the USA with as much money as possible before the next eminent crash. You guys think your just going to make some system that works great and you can just trade successfully for the next 10 or 20 years. HA, no matter what system you run when the crash comes your going to be just like everyone else SOL. That’s not going to be me and I have dedicated months of my time studying and developing the concept I currently use. This dedication will reward me I don’t care how long it takes. I’m willing to devote my whole life to FX, I already eat, sleep and breathe FX and that alone is enough to set me apart from the 98%.
The market crashing is another topic, maybe we should create a thread on it.
[QUOTE=“Leg0nd;616407”] Thank you. You are one of my favorite honorary members at the moment xD. I have a professional view on stop losses I believe. Most trades I take I put a 100 pip sl as an oh **** i’m dead wrong and I didn’t get out manually in time. But you know what? I don’t know any broker than can spike the market 100 pips down to take me out of a trade I still could win in the specified time frame I am holding the trade for. On to the other members saying I am trading “beer money” or “pocket change.” Yes you are correct to an extent. But you know what? If you can’t trade “pocket” change successfully, you can not trade ANY amount of money successfully. My goals in Forex are extremely different than yours my dude. I don’t have the time to lay out my plans for everyone nor do I care too. I have to go but I will be sure to add onto this post when I get back. You look at my trades I have taken this past month and you tell me what I am doing despite my “unacceptable” risk management is not working. All of my successful trades have a pretty damn high “Risk to Reward Ratio.” My losing trades I have not lost that much money on despite my “unacceptable” risk level. The majority of these trades did not have a stop implemented. I only recently just added my 100 pip sl for the reasons posted above. -->Leg0nd System | Myfxbook 62% win rate for month, 71% win rate last week. How does your system compare? Of course winning rates do not mean anything. What matters is the $ amount in winning vs $ amount in losing trades. Obviously my winning trades are much higher than my losing trades otherwise my 110% return this month would not be possible. Yes I’m trading high risk, enough of that already. I’m not conventional, If I was, I wouldn’t be trading anywhere near as successfully as I have been. Nor would I be making this much return off my “pocket” change as quickly. Remember that 98% fail and only the top 2% succeed in FX? Well I’m 100% positive that 2% does not follow or use the 98%'s conventional “wisdom” so to speak. In this market the cream of the crop rises to the top period. I want to hit the market as hard as possible and as quick as possible so I can get the **** out of the USA with as much money as possible before the next eminent crash. You guys think your just going to make some system that works great and you can just trade successfully for the next 10 or 20 years. HA, no matter what system you run when the crash comes your going to be just like everyone else SOL. That’s not going to be me and I have dedicated months of my time studying and developing the concept I currently use. This dedication will reward me I don’t care how long it takes. I’m willing to devote my whole life to FX, I already eat, sleep and breathe FX and that alone is enough to set me apart from the 98%. The market crashing is another topic, maybe we should create a thread on it.[/QUOTE]
Wow earlier in the thread i posted I watched a seminar of a pro trader & that was the exact video i watched where this guy says stop losses are a sure way to loss your money
What are the odds right? I mean this guy made 5 million in 4 years trading Forex. I’m pretty sure his 2 cents are really worth $1. I like his system. It’s solid, conceptually its very sound and makes logical sense. The part how nowadays the market trends more was very interesting. The only reason I haven’t decided to trade his system vs my own is because I want perfection. “Perfection doesn’t exist, you will lose trades,” is a bunch of bullship. If it where not for my desire to find the holy grail, I would be trading his system right now or one of the various successful systems I have built in the past 2 years. Every trader should desire perfection. Whether it’s possible or not is out of the question. It’s the strive to constantly improve that sets the pro’s apart from the noobs.
I 100% agree with his “trade with stop losses and for sure lose your money.” I have lost hella money because of stops, and very smartly placed stops btw. His point is very valid. Brokers make money every time you lose or make money, however, the less money they payout to you, the larger there profits. How do you make faster profits? Spike the market via spreads and take out as many stops as possible. Especially during news.
Yeah, what I liked about his approach is his sense of momentum, no hint of trying to find reversal candle stick patterns or the notion of price ‘rejection’ etc etc.
I may be wrong here but obviously you are being sarcastic. Guess what? I don’t give a **** what your opinion is on my $3 account. The market payed me this past month and that is all that matters as a trader. Like previously stated my goals in FX are 100% different than yours. So before you judge by account size, why don’t you judge by profitability. The beauty of FX is through scalability. If I had 100k at the beginning of the month I would have 210k right now which is still pretty damn unheard of. 110k profit in one month is enough to live off of and not trade the remainder of the year. Now that is something to be proud of. 1 month of work for 11 months of financial support with absolutely no risk. Not unless you can top that, I will gladly shut the **** up.
I get enough hate from family, and friends alike on my particular trading style. I apologize in advance for the language, but when I try to help new traders out by giving them both sides of the argument with valid proof for my statements I can get rather heated… Especially when I am constantly poked at by supposed “pro” traders and having run low on my nicotine. To whomever started this thread, I hope my contributions have helped you better understand the pros and cons of stop losses. After all this thread was designed for that purpose, not to poke fun of my account, or trading style. I am trading live and not demo, which makes my contributions valid no matter how much is in my account. I take real risk, not play money risk. the market reacts to my trades just the same as it would if I had 1 million in my trade. When I trade my $3 into a million no one will be laughing except me. Litterally almost nothing to something huge is the American dream is it not?
My system is in the top 5 most watched as far as trading journal’s go. Maybe people are watching to see if I fail, maybe to watch to see if I succeed, maybe to get some ideas from, who knows? All that matters to me is to keep a journal so I can look back to see where I came from and where I am today. I don’t care about popularity. I never was the popular guy. But I will be damned If I am not in the top .5%, It’s either that or die trying. It’s this kinda motivation that rewards in Forex granted you have the right head on your shoulders, willingness to lose until you become profitable, and the desire to figure out what exactly causes the market to move so that you can be the first in line to make the right decision light years ahead of the shallow minded crowd following stereotypes.
Originality + Ingenious Practical Real World Ideology+ Constant Consistent Implementation = Success.
I remember reading somewhere that traders are in the business of risk management.
If you don’t define your stop loss, then how do you define your risk? If your risk is undefined and you don’t know when to get out, your risk is unmanaged and theoretically limitless.
This post should be plated with gold. 