Setup a trading company in low tax countries?

hiya,

I want to setup a trading company in low lax country and I need help. I’m ready to leave Europe’s high tax counties, so I can save more. Anyone have idea or experience about this? If you can’t write here, please PM me instead. If its cost for me, please PM me the cost of your advise. I can pay by bitcoin after setup is finished.

thnx

Did I read this right? You want to set up a trading company, as in you??

How is this possible when all of your other posts are asking questions based on understanding the fundamentals on how to actually trade in the first instance?

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I learned how to trade and I’m profitable in a specific strategy that I managed to create it now.

Right, ok, and this was the question you just posted a few hours ago? Perhaps you mean you want to open an offshore account, not a company!! In which case the tax all comes back to the UK anyway, regardless of the location of your broker.

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hiya,

There is few possible legal scenarios:

  1. I leave the UK for whole tx year. So I will not tx in UK based on circumstances.
  2. I leave the UK and sometimes come to visit London :slight_smile: then back to my new country. So I will not tx based on circumstances.
  3. I stay in UK but there is possibility that still not tx in UK, based in circumstances. (Hardest scenario in implementation)
  4. I leave the UK to new country and will not coming back. :slight_smile: (Easiest scenario in implementation)

I’m looking someone expert that can advise me on above?

thnx

Ahhhh yes, hope springs eternal

The Never Hopeful VIPER

@campione you mentioned living in the UK. Have you considered spread betting?

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hiya,

Spread betting price is not like spot Forex, its managed internally by broker. I’m not sure if I can win a position in spot Forex, I can win the same in spread betting(if I open both positions at once in two different broker, one spread betting and one ECN), as in spread betting, spread go so wide sometimes and I will be out of margin. I’m not sure there is enough liquidity in the spread betting for my positions or not. When I tried spread betting, positions remain open for some time and will not filled in millisecond. When position filled, because spread is wide, I lose lots of money. There is no spread betting in ECN with tight spread and real liquidity provider price, as far as I know, but I hope it was.

thnx

Hi Campione,
I am no expert, but I have worked in 7 countries, and paid tax in five of them. I have also set up 3 offshore companies in the past, and liquidated two of them. Truth warning here - I am pretty old.
I also used to be friendly with an international tax consultant when I were younger.

Anyway, before you go to the expense of setting up an offshore company, find out from the horses mouth here (call HMRC) to clarify your tax position with regard to forex trading here. The last time I looked, trading profits are exempt from income tax for UK tax residents (most of us) in the same way as trading losses cannot be offset against your taxable income.

And for the record, if you set up an offshore company and failed to report it to the HMRC as a UK resident, you would break the law. One thing I have learned over about 40 years being overseas then resident again, doing stuff legally is cheaper and more straightforward than any other way. I am not suggesting you intended to do anything illegal, but for the maintenance of an offshore company, and assuming you would be paying 20% UK income tax, you would need to be profiting more than about £20K per year to make it worth your while. It would be a shame to spend £4K or so setting up an offshore company only to realize that it was not necessary to do so.
I hope you get some good advice, and best of luck with the trading.

just get Bitcoin and trade forex cfd which use Bitcoin as a collateral and to settle p&l.
then get tax residency in Germany. if you hold your Bitcoins for a year, cashing them out will be tax free. AFAIK.

of course this include the added Bitcoin’s volatility risk in the equation.

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Good idea. LOL. I just realized when I answered this last night it is 3 years old. Doubt our answers will help anyone after that length of time. :frowning:

Hiya @krakw0r

Do you mean a deposit FX trading account with up to maximum possible 50K equivalent of USD in Bitcoin and trade CFD? I only trade FX at the moment and in some brokers, CFD is defined something else than Spot FX in you know what I mean.

Is this applied to Germany residents only?

What shall I do for the rest of my capital after 50K USD as the maximum deposit-able Bitcoin in reputable brokers is 50K USD equivalent in Bitcoin?

?

Tnx and best of luck :blush: :shamrock:

Hiya @Mondeoman

I left the UK about the previous year and the UK is not my tx residency anymore.

This is only applicable to UK residents that doing spread-bet, and there should be some conditions met for you as well to apply under this scheme.
I don’t think anyone could get significant income on spread-bet, as the broker’s internal price manipulation takes most of the trader’s profit.

I was on 45% and 65% tx rate while I was in the UK, as 20% corporate tx+ 45% income tx over corporate income. It become more than 65% while considering council tx, road tx, insurance, and many more tx and licences fees that are required to pay in the UK.
Regarding fx I manage it through a company and my current tx residency defines whether my corporate income tx-able in the current residency or not and if its, it on what rate.
The UK’s local tx office will not in a position to impose any rule on my situation as I’m not coming to UK anymore as because if I come to even visit my friends they start mumbling to the extent that tx me if my days in the UK pass the certain threshold that is defined in the law.

If there is any advice on how to structure my international tx planning for fx trading while I’m living and working abroad to minimize my tx obligation and avoid tx, I’m listening? Considering I may able to move to a better city/country abroad if they offer me the lowest tx rate. :blush:

The ones who live in the UK, even if they structure offshore, they still subject to 20% UK tx, wherever the offshore corporate located doesn’t matter for UK’s local tx office, as per my knowledge nothing does not matter for UK’s local tx office, as long as if you have a corporate abroad and live in the UK they charge your corporate income in flat 20% rate.

I’m not 100% sure, but I don’t know if a UK resident’s corporate income if remain abroad in business and does not bring to the UK, whether its still tx-able on 20% or its on a lower rate?

While I live abroad, and I just come to the UK to visit my Flat/apartment to be sure it’s maintained for a few days a year, and this is my only UK visit, then my local tx office abroad where I’m currently living is the one who dictates my offshore company’s tx-able corporate income.

If you have better international tx planning structure to minimize and avoid the tx, considering I may be able to move to more tx favourable city/country if it helps me and as long as the city is nice and fun, I’m listening?

Tnx and best of luck :blush: :shamrock:

yes. you can also cash out Bitcoin to gold (to offset btc volatility) and hold gold or a year before selling it. this is tax-free in Austria and many other European countries.

no I don’t know what you mean, please enlight me

open accounts on many brokers.
I was thinking explicitly about primexbt

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Is there any guide for this on the internet?

Some brokers do offering Forex under CFD and Spot Forex, with a different trading condition, depends on the broker.

Brokers each of them has many secret things that can’t be achieved unless trading over time with them gives you an idea of how they operate. Moving to non-bank rated brokers is not my choice, I only trade with the ones with who they have a banking license whether the USA or Europe or countries that are finance centers.
Also diversifying money will cause me to lose the leverage and margin on trades, while in the US brokers the margin is only 1:33 in the reputable brokers.

I don’t know that broker, but it will take some time to be sure it’s not a price manipulator. But thanks for the advice on this broker anyway.

Tnx and best of luck :blush: :shamrock:

no.
if you deposit btc on a broker that convert it to fiat, then I think you are subject to taxes. that’s why Bitcoin-based account fx broker are interesting (primexbt, xbtfx.io… they are pretty recent ones, so maybe unsafe) , since this would still let you legally not pay taxes if you hold Bitcoin for more than a year in Germany.

for btc/gold direct trade the most famous exchange is vaultoro.
there are also many companies that deliver physical gold and accept direct btc payments.

those are simply ideas that may very well work, but I’m not a tax expert.
You might want to become a perpetual traveler

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Hi again,
If this were the case, I am surprised you did not use the services of an international tax advisor. The last time we were in a similar situation was 2005, when we moved our overseas business jurisdiction. Tax saving was about eight times the cost of professional jurisdiction advice. One thing is for sure. The advice is unique to the circumstances of the individual (residence, tax residence, domicile, country of business income source, country of tax residence of company). There is no such thing as an international tax planning structure that suits you unless the advisor understands ALL your personal situation.

Thanks. As long as I’m outside the UK, I’ve avoiding it. I left the UK and the government had short on the annual budget projection. lol
I’m happy outside the UK, there are many fun cities that I can travel in Europe and beyond that take me forever to travel around.

Best of luck

Thanks. The most significant issue here is that how can I trust hundred of thousands of money to nonbank rated brokers?

And about the perpetual traveler, again if I use that scheme, I need to maintain a tx residency somewhere, otherwise one of the high tx countries that I traveled there may try to forcefully tx me there. I’m thinking of implementing some projects and business with my many talents for some low tx countries and hold my tx residency there.

Tnx and best of luck :blush: :shamrock:

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The link is to one of 10 books I bought in 1996 by W. G. Hill (cost me over £1,000). It is very much outdated but I am sure many of the principles still apply. Amongst others, there is the Passport Report, the Monaco Report. They are still up in my loft but haven’t seen them for over 10 years. Leather bound and individually numbered in ink.