As for the transition, I really hope I am. A lot of things in my job actually make me feel physically sick, it’s hard to describe. Yet what am I doing about it to change it? Nothing at all, except moaning constantly about it, and where does that get anyone?
So yeah, I hope this is the beginning of my transition. I know that trading has the potential to change the way I live, I know it won’t change it today, tomorrow, it probably won’t even change things too much next year. But as long as I know that it IS there, that it IS achievable, as long as I’m prepared to work for it, then there is hope.
As Christopher Reeves once said, “Once you chose hope, anything’s possible.”
Hog I’ve been through a lot of the things you describe and still do but rarely. One thing I will mention is I feel we’re more likely to succeed as traders if we’re mechanical in how we action our trading. ST is a great example of this. For the past few months I’ve kept telling myself stop bringing emotion/fear/greed into trading.
Emotion - “OMG I’m going to miss this move I’m going to get in now” when there was no clear entry or you should have got in 30 pips+ ago.
Fear - “I’m up 10 pips but price is coming back a bit hmmm let me lock break even”
Greed - “Let me extend my stop loss by another 10 pips I don’t think price will come get me that far”
Once you have rules to how you trade then the next important step in my opinion is the consistent implementation of those rules without deviation. For example I will not enter a trade anymore unless I can see a potential return of double/triple my risk. If its 1:1 I will pass ALWAYS. I’m not saying its wrong to take such a trade but its my rule and I stick to it. Secondly I always set limit orders at determined levels once I’m in a trade which will scale me out of a position and I never adjust these levels once I’ve set them just like I never move my stop anymore. I feel that its in our human nature to f*ck things up/get confused/get scared etc so we should limit our involvement once the trigger has been pulled to enter a trade.
I’m banging on a bit here now lol but the point I’m trying to get across is if the way you trade is profitable then you just need to stick to a good plan no matter what. Losses will come as we can’t win them all but be confident that at the end of the week or month or year even you’re going to be in profit and thats all that matters. The long term gain.
*Sorry for the TYPO’S if any I’m on a caffeine high at the moment lol
Hi HOG
While I can relate to most of what you are saying, we part ways when it comes to setting a stop loss.
I have managed to conquer a few discipline issues, but some still plague me and I accept that they always will. Like impatience, I know it will always be there, so instead of fighting it, I either set a pending order and walk away, or just walk away. The best thing is to be away from the computer, and that’s why I stopped using the iphone to trade. I used to overtrade, so now I limit myself to trading New York only, I’ll miss opportunities I know, but if I can’t trust myself not to overtrade, then I’ll remove the tools from my reach.
But when it comes to setting a stop loss, for me that is not even an option, and seems very strange to me. I have heard that some pros never use stop losses, like that guy who came on here and insulted the entire babypips community within about 20 hours -then got banned. (HeadsIWin, anyone remember that classy act?). Anyway, I know that (some)experienced traders do it, but man, it’s a foreign concept to me.
But I still don’t think focus and discipline have anything to do with not setting a stop loss. That’s more of a conceptual thing. It can work …if your’e right lol
The stop loss thing I agree is open to individual preference, I’ve even heard Nikitafx say she trades without one, but has the mental strength to cut and run if things go against her.
trading without a stop loss can work for you, if you’re right. But trading without one, then finding out you’re wrong and THEN finding out you don’t have the mental strength to cut and run can be a costly business.
Works for some who can deal with imaginary stop loss levels. I prefer to ask myself the question ok if price goes against me where would I want to get out. What level tells me I was wrong and thats where I set my stop loss. If I get kicked out and price goes where I thought it would then my stop was obviously too tight and my analysis was correct. This can be improved over time IMO.
I’m suddenly a little out of date on this thread, behind the curve, but there’s some big stuff being discussed. I’m normally a rambler, but I’ll keep this one short, as it’s simple.
We each of us need to ask ourselves: is this work, or a hobby? Am I trying to make a little useful extra coin, or am I trying to make some money?
There is no right or wrong answer, but there does need to be an honest answer. Anyone not treating this as work is never going to achieve a step change in their finances, never going to move their life into another bracket. They’re just going to have the odd nice win, the odd war story, and have some fun with it. There’s nothing wrong with that, but it is not taking it seriously, so it is not going to become more than that.
If we want to make this into something big, then it has to become work, given an equal footing with other businesses, jobs, bosses etc., encroaching into our sleep, hobbies, all of that, if necessary.
So we all need to decide, is this work, or a hobby? For me, it’s work. For anyone else who considers this work, I’d recommend the opening three or four minutes of this video.
If you don’t set a Stop Loss and then something happens to you - child gets hurt, gas leak, you fall and break your leg - your trading account might get wiped out, too.
I always place a Stop, I just make sure that it is at a level where, if Price reaches there, I know that the underlying thinking behind my trade has not played out and I want my money out of there.
Sorry to be in preachy mode, guys, but this can’t all be play and it feels as though we’re having a moment here in this thread. So let’s have a [I]m[I]oment[/I].[/I]
Well said that man. And it’s funny you should make your post when you did, because the point of this post actually centres around you.
Now I know that all of this chatter of mine may seem to fly in the face of my recent posts about focus, ie why spend so much time posting when you could be trading? but I have no intention of trading this week, or what’s left of it. Nor do I intend doing anything trading related, except finishing my last couple of points on this forum then starting fresh Sunday night. So I may as well use the time to Re-re-establish my foundations.
The first larger posts dealt with focus, or the lack of, and now gives me my first and most important rule :
Focus or Fold, all in or not in at all.
The second post dealt with discipline. Trading for some, without a clearly defined set of rules, may work, as I said, for some. But in keeping with the old advice to find out what kind of trader you are, I’m 20 months into this, I now know what kind of trader I am, and the trouble I get myself into WITHOUT a clearly defined set of rules. Each to their own I suppose, but this is rule No 2 for me.
2, Set your rules down on paper, these are the rules by which you will live your trading life. There will be no detours…ever !!
And the part which centres around ST???
ST has a well known battle cry now. “Trade what you see, NOT what you think.” It’s difficult really to find a fault in that advice. It’s simple, it’s basic and it’s just plain logical. In fact, the only thing that is wrong with it is trying to get people to stick to it. I mean, in what other part of your life, honestly, would you NOT follow that advice.
Let me put another different slant on it for just a second, just to try and illustrate the point.
By some bizarre twist of fate, you and your best mate happen to be flying over the South pole, when your aircraft developes engine problems. Your gonna have to make an emergency landing. You send out a may-day call, then brace yourselves for impact. Luckily, you both survive the crash, but now you’re both faced with a different problem, you’re stranded, geographically, slap bang right in the middle of the South pole.
It’s freezing, it’s the middle of winter and the the wind drives the snow at you both like some-ones firing bullets at you. You would’ve taken shelter in the wreckage of the aircraft, but that exploded shortly after impact and is under 10 feet of snow now anyway. It’s minus 6 bazillion and you’re both huddled there like the last two emperor penguins on earth. The weather is so wild that visibility is almost zero. You’re both in a desperate situation.
You know that if you’re going to survive this, you’re gonna have to hunker down, preserve body heat, keep yourself warm, somehow. Suddenly though, your mate gets to his feet, he looks up at the two inches he can see in front of his eyes, then begins to strip. You can’t believe what your seeing, has he gone mad?
In no time at all, he stands there in front of you wearing only his speedos. His skin is going blue in front of your eyes and his body begins to shake. He’s fu***** lost it, surely? The snow is beginning to settle on him as he quickly gets bluer and bluer. Then you meet each others gaze and he can tell by the look of shock on your face that you think he’s mad.
He holds his hands out in front of him and shouts to you through the howling wind, “Has to brighten up sometime!” And with that he starts to walk off into the blizzard, never to be seen again.
Some time later, you burst out of the snow pile that has formed around you as the distant sound of a helicopter wakes you. You don’t see it at first because the glare of the sun on that cold clear morning obscures it, but you wave frantically nevertheless.
The helicopter lands and one of the crew runs towards you. “I thought there was two of you,” he says, “Where’s your friend?” You spin around and only then do you notice that although it’s still cold, it’s a calm, clear day and the sun is high in the sky, but your friend is nowhere to be seen.
“He left yesterday,” you tell the airman, “On a hunch.”
Okay, okay, a bit corny, but trust me, I have no desire to see any of you lot in your speedos. Deal with what IS happening, not with what you THINK is going to happen.
I still think ST’s version is simpler though LOL!! But it is rule number 3:
I officially have ADD, pills and all that, so I’ve spent some time on focus and discipline issues. I believe people need to set reasonable and realistic expectations. In other words we have to be playing in a game we are able to win.
What’s reasonable and realistic varies from person-to-person. And more to the point, varies tremendously according to the situation, family and work responsibilities and obligations, surrounding each of our lives.
After a few years of watching folks come and go on babypips I have some opinions and here’s one of them.
If you have a real full-time job, an active family and are attempting to trade a method where you need to check-in more than once a day for longer than 20-30 minutes per day you’re probably playing a game you are not able to win.
With all that goes with a full-time job and active family it’s just not reasonable and realistic to be checking in and placing trades all day long. There will be exceptions but isn’t it a more realistic goal to become very good at a task than fail attempting to be a “once in a decade super-star”?
Unfortunately for the folks with real jobs & families many of the active threads here in bp-land are geared towards intra-day & day trading and might be steering some in a dangerous direction. For example, if you have the time and opportunity to sit in front of the charts all morning, Nikitafx’s Pure Price Action For Dummies thread is a wonderful trading method to follow.
But if you try to trade her method around a full-time job and family all you’ll do is frustrate, twist yourself up and fail. [B]And then blame and beat yourself up for failing because of lack of focus and discipline,[/B] get my point?
Play a game you can win, try to find 20-30 minutes at approximately the same time every day and try some end of day trading methods, IMO it’s a game a working man/woman with an active family has a real good chance of winning.
If you find you have additional free time during the day use it to study, read, watch vids, etc. Don’t use it to throw down some quickie trades on the 15m, discipline yourself to only place trades according to your EOD plan and method. Don’t fall for the trap of the cheap quick thrill.
Thats pretty deep there D-pip and spot on. You have to fit your trading to your lifestyle and circumstances if not you will never get out alive. I see this all to often people trying to day trade when they can only look at a chart in the evening. It no wander it is not working. Some will set a TP but and thats better than nothing buttrade what you can trade leave the rest for others to gamble on
Ah, bobmaninc…I was thinking about you earlier mate.
Just wondered at the time if you’d happened to see the very large “oh no I don’t like being up this high, I prefer it way down here” candle on the bobmaninc 4 hr today?
Well after my 12 pip loss this morning (or last night I am not sure when exactly I was stopped out. The bobmaninc and i are not on speaking terms right now. So no I have not even looked at it all day.
Ok curiosity kills the cat so I took a peek. Little late in the day to be trading that on a friday
Didn’t trade it myself, but due to the fact i was home cos the little one isn’t too good just now I had the benefit of watching it develop real time. Must admit you crossed my mind as I was watching it.
That had me laughing out loud and had the family staring at me like I was crazy…
Picturing you blobbing your can of root beer out the window on to the motorway.
Anyway, sorry had to mention that.
On a plus note I’ve just read the last few pages of this thread and may read it from the start. There’s been some good food for thought in there regarding will and focus that I’m going to try (no) take on board.
So starting Sunday I’m going to lob my focus into the 4HR and D1 charts and trade nothing lower as my day job performance has fallen through the floor these last 3-6 months leaving me in a precarious position.
Thanks guys for the focus (and again IyaJenkei) for the giggle!
Hi Gang, hope you all had a good weekend. 5 days in front of us without Xmas shopping, life is good sometimes !!!
Dunno if it is because we ARE getting close to the holidays but things barely got above snails pace today.
On the face of it I would tend to be going long EU just now.
EU Daily;
Daily chart formed a good bull engulf today, admittedly a bit in the middle of a range, but worth keeping any eye on.
FXCM Dollar Index:
At the same time FXCM’s own dollar index chart is showing weakness, not as clear cut as you’d probably like it to be mind you but again, worth watching.
USD/CHF, which as far as I can tell, shows a negative correlation to the euro dollar, is showing a good bear engulf as we head to the close of today.
If things were a bit more liquid I’d be tempted to drill down a bit and see if there were any entry points in this post, but since I’m running short of time tonight I might not have a chance to put up what I find, if anything.
Trying to take the good advice given recently and concentrate more on an end of day strategy, may be getting to close to the holidays to find anything worth writing home about though.
Hog your EU daily chart is different to mine. I assume you have sunday candles whereas I don’t. No bullish engulfing on mine.
As for EU I have a bullish bias overall as I’m looking to see it hunt 1.3200 but I still feel there is some room on this move down to 1.2830. This opinion is based strictly on the daily chart obviously.
I think that may be part f the reason that a lot of traders sit out on a monday Aesthetic as the inclusion of Sunday data may well give out some false signals. It may well be better to wait 'til a Tuesday for the first “real” set of data.
This is my EU daily chart going back tot he start of September. I’ve marked the 1-2825/30 area you mentioned and it’s plain to see why it’s an area of interest.
The problem I always have with the EU is that it seems to grind it’s way slowly up regardless, unless some news comes out which is nothing short of carnage.
I think looking at the 4 hour chart though, price will need a good hard push down if it’s to break through the 1-2880 mark though.
Maybe it’s just waiting for me to hit the “buy” button before it goes into freefall LOL!!
